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Date: 23 Aug 2006 00:17:53
From: Dave Lee
Subject: Partial Review - "People Against the Pros"
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The "People Against the Pros" ( http://www.pvpgolf.com/ ) was held today on
Pinehurst No. 8. In a nutshell there was a handicap adjusted tournament held
at Pinehurst and the under 50 age group winner played Retief Goosen and the
over 50 age group winner played Gary McCord. The pro event was held today.
Pinehurst No. 8 is a relatively tough course (7100 yards, par 72, 74.2/135)
that with a couple of minor changes could probably hold a 'standard PGA tour
event' (assuming the appropriate course setup). However, today was most
certainly not 'appropriate course setup'. It was the standard resort play,
late summer course setup. The greens were relatively slow, very heavily
watered and soft, and the rough was virtually non-existent (BIG errors off
the tee are severely punished, but small errors generally yielded very
playable lies).
I only watched the Goosen vs. Greg McGraw (amateur from Florida) match, so
can't comment on the McCord match. McGraw got 12 strokes from Retief. I
asked at least a half dozen different 'officials' what Greg's index was.
They didn't know and also didn't know how Retief's index factored into the
12 strokes.
One official did have a "Golfnet generated" scorecard with Greg's name (only
Greg's). In the place where your full course handicap always shows up was a
"15". Greg was playing the blue tees (slope 129). So it sounds like he has
around a 13 index. The slope moved that up to 15 and the 80% (per event
rules) dropped it down to 12.
Since Retief played the Gold tees (7100 yards) and Greg played the Blues
(6700 yards), that apparently was considered adequate compensation for the
fact that Retief is probably a +6, or something like that.
Greg is a 40'ish, heavy-set guy. He has a short, compact swing. While not
stylish, it is very repeatable, stays relatively on-plane, and isn't going
to get him in trouble often. He hits a pretty big fade (IMHO it is just
short of being a slice) with every club in his bag, but he understands how
it works and plays it effectively. An "average good" drive for him is
probably around 230 yards on soft/watered fairways. I would guess his index
to be more like a 10 except for the fact that he is a poor putter (unlike
his swing which isn't fatally flawed, his putting stroke has serious wrist
collapse).
Retief was having all kinds of trouble, rushing his swing at the top leading
to duckhooks, he bladed two partial wedge shots 30 yards over the green ....
sorry, I got confused. That was my last round :-)
Retief's swing is what it is - beautiful to watch.
I was pretty impressed with how Greg handled the pressure. The first hole is
a short par 4 (361 from the Golds, 338 Blues), dogleg left. Greg hit a nice
3W to about 120 yards. I was really surprised to see Retief hit driver. He
just blasted the ball through the dogleg, past all the trees, and 30'ish
yards short/right of the green in the non-existent rough, pitch to 18
inches, conceded birdie. I guess that's why Retief hit driver.
Greg left his approach a few yards short of the green, but with no stroke
that hole ended quickly.
#2 is a par 5 (559/532 yards). Retief crunched a driver and mashed some kind
of long iron to 20' for an easy birdie. Greg hit his drive a bit right, but
hit a nice little fade on his second shot to recover from what looked like a
tough position. He found the green on his 3rd but 3 putted to go two down
(despite the stroke). Welcome to the real world, Greg. But the truth is that
Greg has yet to hit a really bad shot and I felt that he handled a tough
situation pretty well.
Hole #3 was halved with a stroke, but hole #4 (par 4, 464/438 yards) was a
tough one for Greg. It plays a slight dogleg left around a sandy waste
bunker. Retief could fire toward the green, carrying the waste bunker and
dogleg. Greg had to aim to the right. Retief had a 130 yard approach while
Greg (despite hitting a good drive) had a 220 yard fairway wood. Greg pulled
it badly into the trees to the left ending with his first double. But for
the most part Greg did not hit many really bad shots.
#5 is a short par 3 (149/138) and Retief hit his tee shot long/left bounding
down the bank behind the green. Greg's shot found the green. Maybe Retief
had a lie problem, but he was damn lucky that his second shot didn't roll
back to his feet. Greg won with a par, which had to help his spirits.
Hole #6 (par 5, 604/584) probably helped Greg's spirits as well. Retief
couldn't get home in two, but had a 15 foot birdie putt. Greg's 3rd found
the greenside bunker in a pretty difficult buried lie. This was clearly
going to be a 'feature shot' as there was extra camera activity showing the
lie and after Greg's shot they had Retief step in and give a demo on how the
shot should be played. Greg hit a great shot to 8' (better than Retief's
demo shot, BTW). Hole halved after both missed their short putts.
Then on hole #7 (par 4, 370/346) Greg actually pulled his approach shot but
a good bounce off a slope in the green left him with an 8' birdie putt which
he made for an outright win (no strokes given).
Hole #8 is a tough par 3 (238/201) and both had birdie putts (that is a
pretty good shot for a 13 handicapper, even if he was 40' from the pin).
Greg 3 putted to halve the hole with Retief, who parred.
Hole #9 (par 4, 441/418) was the source of the only other really bad shot
that Greg hit on the front side. Greg had a 200'ish yard approach that he
pulled badly into the 'love grass' well left of the green.
I believe that Greg ended the front side down 2. I had things to do that
afternoon so I didn't see the final 9 (or any of the McCord match). But it
was fun to watch and fun to think "wonder how I would have done in those
circumstances'. Greg must have been somewhere around 6 or 7 over on the
front and I think that Retief was 2 under. Retief couldn't buy a putt with a
Cashier's Check.
I believe that this will be televised sometime in ober.
dave
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Date: 23 Aug 2006 09:29:31
From: Jim Garnett
Subject: Re: Partial Review - "People Against the Pros"
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In article <R8NGg.7545$Sn3.1183@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net >,
"Dave Lee" <DaveLeeNC@ix.netcom.RemovE.com > wrote:
>The "People Against the Pros" ( http://www.pvpgolf.com/ ) was held today
>on
>Pinehurst No. 8. In a nutshell there was a handicap adjusted tournament
>held
>at Pinehurst and the under 50 age group winner played Retief Goosen and
>the
>over 50 age group winner played Gary McCord. The pro event was held today.
>
>Pinehurst No. 8 is a relatively tough course (7100 yards, par 72,
>74.2/135)
>that with a couple of minor changes could probably hold a 'standard PGA
>tour
>event' (assuming the appropriate course setup). However, today was most
>certainly not 'appropriate course setup'. It was the standard resort play,
>late summer course setup. The greens were relatively slow, very heavily
>watered and soft, and the rough was virtually non-existent (BIG errors off
>the tee are severely punished, but small errors generally yielded very
>playable lies).
>
>I only watched the Goosen vs. Greg McGraw (amateur from Florida) match, so
>can't comment on the McCord match. McGraw got 12 strokes from Retief. I
>asked at least a half dozen different 'officials' what Greg's index was.
>They didn't know and also didn't know how Retief's index factored into the
>12 strokes.
>
>One official did have a "Golfnet generated" scorecard with Greg's name
>(only
>Greg's). In the place where your full course handicap always shows up was
>a
>"15". Greg was playing the blue tees (slope 129). So it sounds like he has
>around a 13 index. The slope moved that up to 15 and the 80% (per event
>rules) dropped it down to 12.
>
>Since Retief played the Gold tees (7100 yards) and Greg played the Blues
>(6700 yards), that apparently was considered adequate compensation for the
>fact that Retief is probably a +6, or something like that.
>
>Greg is a 40'ish, heavy-set guy. He has a short, compact swing. While not
>stylish, it is very repeatable, stays relatively on-plane, and isn't going
>to get him in trouble often. He hits a pretty big fade (IMHO it is just
>short of being a slice) with every club in his bag, but he understands how
>it works and plays it effectively. An "average good" drive for him is
>probably around 230 yards on soft/watered fairways. I would guess his
>index
>to be more like a 10 except for the fact that he is a poor putter (unlike
>his swing which isn't fatally flawed, his putting stroke has serious wrist
>collapse).
>
>Retief was having all kinds of trouble, rushing his swing at the top
>leading
>to duckhooks, he bladed two partial wedge shots 30 yards over the green
>....
>sorry, I got confused. That was my last round :-)
>
>Retief's swing is what it is - beautiful to watch.
>
>I was pretty impressed with how Greg handled the pressure. The first hole
>is
>a short par 4 (361 from the Golds, 338 Blues), dogleg left. Greg hit a
>nice
>3W to about 120 yards. I was really surprised to see Retief hit driver. He
>just blasted the ball through the dogleg, past all the trees, and 30'ish
>yards short/right of the green in the non-existent rough, pitch to 18
>inches, conceded birdie. I guess that's why Retief hit driver.
>
>Greg left his approach a few yards short of the green, but with no stroke
>that hole ended quickly.
>
>#2 is a par 5 (559/532 yards). Retief crunched a driver and mashed some
>kind
>of long iron to 20' for an easy birdie. Greg hit his drive a bit right,
>but
>hit a nice little fade on his second shot to recover from what looked like
>a
>tough position. He found the green on his 3rd but 3 putted to go two down
>(despite the stroke). Welcome to the real world, Greg. But the truth is
>that
>Greg has yet to hit a really bad shot and I felt that he handled a tough
>situation pretty well.
>
>Hole #3 was halved with a stroke, but hole #4 (par 4, 464/438 yards) was a
>tough one for Greg. It plays a slight dogleg left around a sandy waste
>bunker. Retief could fire toward the green, carrying the waste bunker and
>dogleg. Greg had to aim to the right. Retief had a 130 yard approach while
>Greg (despite hitting a good drive) had a 220 yard fairway wood. Greg
>pulled
>it badly into the trees to the left ending with his first double. But for
>the most part Greg did not hit many really bad shots.
>
>#5 is a short par 3 (149/138) and Retief hit his tee shot long/left
>bounding
>down the bank behind the green. Greg's shot found the green. Maybe Retief
>had a lie problem, but he was damn lucky that his second shot didn't roll
>back to his feet. Greg won with a par, which had to help his spirits.
>
>Hole #6 (par 5, 604/584) probably helped Greg's spirits as well. Retief
>couldn't get home in two, but had a 15 foot birdie putt. Greg's 3rd found
>the greenside bunker in a pretty difficult buried lie. This was clearly
>going to be a 'feature shot' as there was extra camera activity showing
>the
>lie and after Greg's shot they had Retief step in and give a demo on how
>the
>shot should be played. Greg hit a great shot to 8' (better than Retief's
>demo shot, BTW). Hole halved after both missed their short putts.
>
>Then on hole #7 (par 4, 370/346) Greg actually pulled his approach shot
>but
>a good bounce off a slope in the green left him with an 8' birdie putt
>which
>he made for an outright win (no strokes given).
>
>Hole #8 is a tough par 3 (238/201) and both had birdie putts (that is a
>pretty good shot for a 13 handicapper, even if he was 40' from the pin).
>Greg 3 putted to halve the hole with Retief, who parred.
>
>Hole #9 (par 4, 441/418) was the source of the only other really bad shot
>that Greg hit on the front side. Greg had a 200'ish yard approach that he
>pulled badly into the 'love grass' well left of the green.
>
>I believe that Greg ended the front side down 2. I had things to do that
>afternoon so I didn't see the final 9 (or any of the McCord match). But it
>was fun to watch and fun to think "wonder how I would have done in those
>circumstances'. Greg must have been somewhere around 6 or 7 over on the
>front and I think that Retief was 2 under. Retief couldn't buy a putt with
>a
>Cashier's Check.
>
>I believe that this will be televised sometime in ober.
>
>dave
Thanks Dave, great story!
~j.
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