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Main
Date: 07 Oct 2006 00:44:26
From: Colin Wilson
Subject: Course photographs
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Forgive the oblique advertising, but thought you might like to see some
photographs I took of my "dungheap" recently.
The photos are at http://publishing.kyneton.net.au/trentham/photos.html.
Spent one morning at sunrise trying to get the right light, and snapped
the first one almost by accident. Then a few days later the one
beautiful morning came along, with mist suspended around the valley, and
I managed to get the second two.
The three (framed) are being used as trophies for the winning team of
three in the 2006 Victorian Country Teams Championship, which is being
held at my course this weekend.
--
Cheers
Colin Wilson
------------------------------------------------------------------
Trentham Golf Club: http://www.trenthamgolf.com
Barnbougle Dunes: http://publishing.kyneton.net.au/barnbougle
------------------------------------------------------------------
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Date: 07 Oct 2006 00:32:42
From: A Brick in the Wall
Subject: Re: Course photographs
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"Colin Wilson" <nowhere@nospam.com > wrote in message
news:KLCVg.42668$rP1.11618@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
> Forgive the oblique advertising, but thought you might like to see some
> photographs I took of my "dungheap" recently.
>
> The photos are at http://publishing.kyneton.net.au/trentham/photos.html.
>
> Spent one morning at sunrise trying to get the right light, and snapped
> the first one almost by accident. Then a few days later the one beautiful
> morning came along, with mist suspended around the valley, and I managed
> to get the second two.
>
> The three (framed) are being used as trophies for the winning team of
> three in the 2006 Victorian Country Teams Championship, which is being
> held at my course this weekend.
>
> --
> Cheers
> Colin Wilson
> ------------------------------------------------------------------
> Trentham Golf Club: http://www.trenthamgolf.com
> Barnbougle Dunes: http://publishing.kyneton.net.au/barnbougle
> ------------------------------------------------------------------
Nice photos --- how far apart are those 2 greens & how long are the normal
approach shots to them? I think I could bean someone one there...
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Date: 06 Oct 2006 19:29:59
From: annika1980
Subject: Re: Course photographs
|
3putt wrote:
> Nice layout Colin. But shouldn't you copy protect your photos?
Why? How?
They are small enough to be of little use for anything other than web
use.
Putting a big ugly watermark on the photos just detracts from the
quality of the pics.
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Date: 07 Oct 2006 02:24:25
From: Peter Strauss
Subject: Re: Course photographs
|
On Sat, 07 2006 00:44:26 GMT, Colin Wilson <nowhere@nospam.com >
wrote:
> Forgive the oblique advertising, but thought you might like to see some
> photographs I took of my "dungheap" recently.
>
> The photos are at http://publishing.kyneton.net.au/trentham/photos.html.
>
> Spent one morning at sunrise trying to get the right light, and snapped
> the first one almost by accident. Then a few days later the one
> beautiful morning came along, with mist suspended around the valley, and
> I managed to get the second two.
>
> The three (framed) are being used as trophies for the winning team of
> three in the 2006 Victorian Country Teams Championship, which is being
> held at my course this weekend.
Colin, those are just beautiful photos! Great work!
Peter
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Date: 07 Oct 2006 01:13:34
From: 3putt
Subject: Re: Course photographs
|
"Colin Wilson" <nowhere@nospam.com > wrote in message
news:KLCVg.42668$rP1.11618@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
> Forgive the oblique advertising, but thought you might like to see some
> photographs I took of my "dungheap" recently.
>
> The photos are at http://publishing.kyneton.net.au/trentham/photos.html.
>
> Spent one morning at sunrise trying to get the right light, and snapped
> the first one almost by accident. Then a few days later the one beautiful
> morning came along, with mist suspended around the valley, and I managed
> to get the second two.
>
> The three (framed) are being used as trophies for the winning team of
> three in the 2006 Victorian Country Teams Championship, which is being
> held at my course this weekend.
>
> --
> Cheers
> Colin Wilson
Nice layout Colin. But shouldn't you copy protect your photos?
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Date: 06 Oct 2006 17:54:33
From: long&left
Subject: Re: Course photographs
|
Colin Wilson wrote:
> Forgive the oblique advertising, but thought you might like to see some
> photographs I took of my "dungheap" recently.
>
> The photos are at http://publishing.kyneton.net.au/trentham/photos.html.
>
> Spent one morning at sunrise trying to get the right light, and snapped
> the first one almost by accident. Then a few days later the one
> beautiful morning came along, with mist suspended around the valley, and
> I managed to get the second two.
>
> The three (framed) are being used as trophies for the winning team of
> three in the 2006 Victorian Country Teams Championship, which is being
> held at my course this weekend.
>
Colin, what kind of trees are the prevalent ones in the photos? They
look like Eucalyptus...We have lots of them here (central coast of CA)
but they are not native and we treat them like weeds. A nearby housing
development cut down 120,000 of them and ground them up for landscape
bark. I've always wondered where they came from.
Dave
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Date: 07 Oct 2006 01:25:59
From: Colin Wilson
Subject: Re: Course photographs
|
long&left wrote:
> what kind of trees are the prevalent ones in the photos? They
> look like Eucalyptus...We have lots of them here (central coast of CA)
> but they are not native and we treat them like weeds. A nearby housing
> development cut down 120,000 of them and ground them up for landscape
> bark. I've always wondered where they came from.
The picturesque tree near the greens in first two photographs is a
Blackwood, a long-lived acacia species that is a wonderful furniture
timber. The rest are tall eucalyptus (commonly called "gum trees"),
predominantly Manna gums, Candlebarks and Messmates. Native to Australia
and probably the most wildfire-inducing species on the planet!
The ones in CA were probably Blue gums (e. globulus) introduced from
here. They also make good timber and paper.
Funnily enough, we have lots of Monterrey pines (pinus radiata) and
other firs planted around the course as features or woodlots. They're
fireweeds too!
--
Cheers
Colin Wilson
------------------------------------------------------------------
Trentham Golf Club: http://www.trenthamgolf.com
Barnbougle Dunes: http://publishing.kyneton.net.au/barnbougle
------------------------------------------------------------------
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Date: 06 Oct 2006 19:58:53
From: long&left
Subject: Re: Course photographs
|
Colin Wilson wrote:
> long&left wrote:
>
>> what kind of trees are the prevalent ones in the photos? They look
>> like Eucalyptus...We have lots of them here (central coast of CA) but
>> they are not native and we treat them like weeds. A nearby housing
>> development cut down 120,000 of them and ground them up for landscape
>> bark. I've always wondered where they came from.
>
> The picturesque tree near the greens in first two photographs is a
> Blackwood, a long-lived acacia species that is a wonderful furniture
> timber. The rest are tall eucalyptus (commonly called "gum trees"),
> predominantly Manna gums, Candlebarks and Messmates. Native to Australia
> and probably the most wildfire-inducing species on the planet!
>
> The ones in CA were probably Blue gums (e. globulus) introduced from
> here. They also make good timber and paper.
>
> Funnily enough, we have lots of Monterrey pines (pinus radiata) and
> other firs planted around the course as features or woodlots. They're
> fireweeds too!
>
in a State Park near where I live (Montana de Oro
http://tinyurl.com/fgksg) there is a 1400 acre parcel of what is now
state of CA land that has row upon row of perfectly planted Eucalyptus
trees. Story has it that back in the early 1900's a fellow decided that
there was going to be a housing boom here. Well, he was right about that
but unfortunately the Eucalyptus tree, at least the ones we have here,
makes for lousy timber for building. So the trees remain as a tribute to
an entrepreneurial failure
weeds they were, and weeds they are!
Dave
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Date: 07 Oct 2006 23:29:29
From: Colin Wilson
Subject: Re: Course photographs
|
long&left wrote:
> in a State Park near where I live (Montana de Oro
> http://tinyurl.com/fgksg)
Nice spot.
> there is a 1400 acre parcel of what is now
> state of CA land that has row upon row of perfectly planted Eucalyptus
> trees. Story has it that back in the early 1900's a fellow decided that
> there was going to be a housing boom here. Well, he was right about that
> but unfortunately the Eucalyptus tree, at least the ones we have here,
> makes for lousy timber for building. So the trees remain as a tribute to
> an entrepreneurial failure
Blue gums can grow about 200+feet tall!
Hundred of thousands of hectares of leased farmland in my State are
being planted to blue gum plantations. They grow quickly and when cut
coppice again from the stumps. They can be harvested three times on a
15-20 year rotation. They will be chipped in Japan for paper production
... they make the world's best paper, something about cellulose fibre
length apparently. At least they're an alternative to felling State
forests.
We have some blue gums on my course ... you know the old story about
"ten years ago I could hit over that corner".
--
Cheers
Colin Wilson
------------------------------------------------------------------
Trentham Golf Club: http://www.trenthamgolf.com
Barnbougle Dunes: http://publishing.kyneton.net.au/barnbougle
------------------------------------------------------------------
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Date: 07 Oct 2006 19:21:26
From: long&left
Subject: Re: Course photographs
|
Colin Wilson wrote:
> long&left wrote:
>
>> in a State Park near where I live (Montana de Oro
>> http://tinyurl.com/fgksg)
>
> Nice spot.
>
>> there is a 1400 acre parcel of what is now state of CA land that has
>> row upon row of perfectly planted Eucalyptus trees. Story has it that
>> back in the early 1900's a fellow decided that there was going to be a
>> housing boom here. Well, he was right about that but unfortunately the
>> Eucalyptus tree, at least the ones we have here, makes for lousy
>> timber for building. So the trees remain as a tribute to an
>> entrepreneurial failure
>
> Blue gums can grow about 200+feet tall!
>
> Hundred of thousands of hectares of leased farmland in my State are
> being planted to blue gum plantations. They grow quickly and when cut
> coppice again from the stumps. They can be harvested three times on a
> 15-20 year rotation. They will be chipped in Japan for paper production
> ... they make the world's best paper, something about cellulose fibre
> length apparently. At least they're an alternative to felling State
> forests.
>
> We have some blue gums on my course ... you know the old story about
> "ten years ago I could hit over that corner".
>
I'll have to do some investigation into what type of trees Euc there are
here. I didn't realize that there were different types of "weeds" :)
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Date: 07 Oct 2006 02:26:56
From: Peter Strauss
Subject: Re: Course photographs
|
On Sat, 07 2006 01:25:59 GMT, Colin Wilson <nowhere@nospam.com >
wrote:
> long&left wrote:
>
> > what kind of trees are the prevalent ones in the photos? They
> > look like Eucalyptus...We have lots of them here (central coast of CA)
> > but they are not native and we treat them like weeds. A nearby housing
> > development cut down 120,000 of them and ground them up for landscape
> > bark. I've always wondered where they came from.
>
> The picturesque tree near the greens in first two photographs is a
> Blackwood, a long-lived acacia species that is a wonderful furniture
> timber. The rest are tall eucalyptus (commonly called "gum trees"),
> predominantly Manna gums, Candlebarks and Messmates. Native to Australia
> and probably the most wildfire-inducing species on the planet!
>
> The ones in CA were probably Blue gums (e. globulus) introduced from
> here. They also make good timber and paper.
>
> Funnily enough, we have lots of Monterrey pines (pinus radiata) and
> other firs planted around the course as features or woodlots. They're
> fireweeds too!
Where I live, in the Oakland Hills, the history of which includes the
firestorm of the same name, the most prevalent trees are the Monterey
pines and the blue gum eucalyptus.
Someone brought them here, can't remember the name right now, and
infected the entire East Bay with 'em. Candles. Absolute exploding
candles. And the Monterey pines are a close second.
Pretty, though...
Peter
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Date: 07 Oct 2006 23:39:06
From: Colin Wilson
Subject: Re: Course photographs
|
Peter Strauss wrote:
> Someone brought them here, can't remember the name right now, and
> infected the entire East Bay with 'em. Candles. Absolute exploding
> candles.
Sounds like the whole Australian "bush"!
And the Monterey pines are a close second.
Monterrey pines, or Radiata pines, are grown extensively here for
softwood timber plantations (house framing, panelling, cheap furniture
etc.). Thousands of square kilometres of the stuff. We've had a history
of wildfires destroying these plantations but they keep planting more. A
very risky business if you ask me.
> Pretty, though...
I don't like radiata pine forests because they are very monocultural.
Our native animals can't live in them, and fires love the dead lower
branches and the thick needle blanket on the ground.
We have a couple of small plantations of radiata on my golf course. The
crunch will come in 10-20 years when they get to harvestable age and we
have to work out whether to get some income while they in their prime,
or leave them for their aesthetics. Nothing looks worse than the
moonscape of a felled radiata planation.
And can someone tell me how to hit a golf ball successfully off a
blanket of pine needles?
--
Cheers
Colin Wilson
------------------------------------------------------------------
Trentham Golf Club: http://www.trenthamgolf.com
Barnbougle Dunes: http://publishing.kyneton.net.au/barnbougle
------------------------------------------------------------------
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Date: 08 Oct 2006 00:24:21
From: Chris Bellomy
Subject: Re: Course photographs
|
Colin Wilson <nowhere@nospam.com > wrote:
: And can someone tell me how to hit a golf ball successfully off a
: blanket of pine needles?
Thin.
--
Chris Bellomy
C-List Charter Member
http://clist.org/
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Date: 09 Oct 2006 08:51:49
From: david s-a
Subject: Re: Course photographs
|
Colin Wilson wrote:
> And can someone tell me how to hit a golf ball successfully off a
> blanket of pine needles?
>
They are loose impediments Colin....remove them in a largish radius
around the ball, leaving the ball virtually tee'd up....easy!
cheers
david
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Date: 08 Oct 2006 23:11:38
From: Colin Wilson
Subject: Re: Course photographs
|
david s-a wrote:
> They are loose impediments Colin....remove them in a largish radius
> around the ball, leaving the ball virtually tee'd up....easy!
The problem is when your ball is on a blanket of pine needles, you are
usually *under* the pine trees. :-(
In which case, you are trying to keep the ball low, and "teeing it up"
doesn't exactly encourage this. My difficulty is always stopping it from
popping up.
Chris suggested hit it thin, a pro friend also suggested punching it
from about six inches behind you right foot.
--
Cheers
Colin Wilson
------------------------------------------------------------------
Trentham Golf Club: http://www.trenthamgolf.com
Barnbougle Dunes: http://publishing.kyneton.net.au/barnbougle
------------------------------------------------------------------
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Date: 08 Oct 2006 09:53:46
From: Loudon Briggs
Subject: Re: Course photographs
|
Colin Wilson <nowhere@nospam.com > wrote:
>
>The picturesque tree near the greens in first two photographs is a
>Blackwood, a long-lived acacia species that is a wonderful furniture
>timber. The rest are tall eucalyptus (commonly called "gum trees"),
>predominantly Manna gums, Candlebarks and Messmates. Native to Australia
>and probably the most wildfire-inducing species on the planet!
>
>The ones in CA were probably Blue gums (e. globulus) introduced from
>here. They also make good timber and paper.
>
>Funnily enough, we have lots of Monterrey pines (pinus radiata) and
>other firs planted around the course as features or woodlots. They're
>fireweeds too!
Terrific photography, Colin. Maybe you can answer a question about
"trees."
About 70 years ago, we rented a place with grounds galore. A terrific
place, except to my 16 year old mind, which only noticed the work that
had to be done to maintain it. However, there was one set of four
trees at the entrance that were absolutely stunning... when in season
they developed red foliage that passersby would stop and ask about.
I know they had been imported and unless my mind has totally left me,
they were called "Australian Flaming Oak" or perhaps "Fire Oak"... I
can't recall for sure. Does either name sound familiar?
--
Loudon R. Briggs larebe@bbz.net Phoenix, AZ
"How Can You Not Like A Game Where It's Okay To
Get Teed Off, Tote A Six-Iron, Shoot Birdies,
and If You're Under Par It's A Great Day!"
(from "Frank & Ernest" by Bob Thaves -- used with permission)
|
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Date: 08 Oct 2006 12:06:39
From: Bobby Knight
Subject: Re: Course photographs
|
On Sun, 08 2006 09:53:46 -0700, Loudon Briggs <larebe@bbz.net >
wrote:
<clip >
>About 70 years ago, we rented a place with grounds galore. A terrific
>place, except to my 16 year old mind, which only noticed the work that
>had to be done to maintain it. However, there was one set of four
>trees at the entrance that were absolutely stunning... when in season
>they developed red foliage that passersby would stop and ask about.
>
>I know they had been imported and unless my mind has totally left me,
>they were called "Australian Flaming Oak" or perhaps "Fire Oak"... I
>can't recall for sure. Does either name sound familiar?
Hi Loudon:
Colin may know the answer, but since it is in the US, we do have an
eminent bioligist on RSG. Rob Hamilton, who will know.
If you don't get an answer from Colin, or The Professor (Rob) doesn't
see this thread, just ping him here. Let him know the specific area
of what state.
BK
___,
\o
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Date: 08 Oct 2006 18:06:30
From: Loudon Briggs
Subject: Re: Course photographs
|
Bobby Knight <bknight@conramp.net > wrote:
>On Sun, 08 2006 09:53:46 -0700, Loudon Briggs <larebe@bbz.net>
>wrote:
(CLIP)
>>I know they had been imported and unless my mind has totally left me,
>>they were called "Australian Flaming Oak" or perhaps "Fire Oak"... I
>>can't recall for sure. Does either name sound familiar?
>
>
>Hi Loudon:
>
>Colin may know the answer, but since it is in the US, we do have an
>eminent bioligist on RSG. Rob Hamilton, who will know.
>
>If you don't get an answer from Colin, or The Professor (Rob) doesn't
>see this thread, just ping him here. Let him know the specific area
>of what state.
>
>BK
Thanks for the help Bobby... as you can see, Colin gave me the answer.
He's right... they were spectacular. They'd stand out at Augusta. :}
> ___,
> \o
>
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Date: 08 Oct 2006 22:23:47
From: Colin Wilson
Subject: Re: Course photographs
|
Loudon Briggs wrote:
> Maybe you can answer a question about "trees."
>
> About 70 years ago, we rented a place with grounds galore. A terrific
> place, except to my 16 year old mind, which only noticed the work that
> had to be done to maintain it. However, there was one set of four
> trees at the entrance that were absolutely stunning... when in season
> they developed red foliage that passersby would stop and ask about.
>
> I know they had been imported and unless my mind has totally left me,
> they were called "Australian Flaming Oak" or perhaps "Fire Oak"... I
> can't recall for sure. Does either name sound familiar?
It would be the Flame Tree (Brachychiton Acerifolius), also called the
Illawarra Flame Tree or the Flame Kurrajong. Absolutely spectacular when
it flowers in spring.
http://lamington.nrsm.uq.edu.au/Documents/Plant/flamekurrajong.htm
http://selectree.calpoly.edu/treedetail.lasso?rid=213
--
Cheers
Colin Wilson
------------------------------------------------------------------
Trentham Golf Club: http://www.trenthamgolf.com
Barnbougle Dunes: http://publishing.kyneton.net.au/barnbougle
------------------------------------------------------------------
|
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Date: 08 Oct 2006 22:45:06
From: Loudon Briggs
Subject: Re: Course photographs
|
Colin Wilson <nowhere@nospam.com > wrote:
>(CLIP)
>
>It would be the Flame Tree (Brachychiton Acerifolius), also called the
>Illawarra Flame Tree or the Flame Kurrajong. Absolutely spectacular when
>it flowers in spring.
>
>http://lamington.nrsm.uq.edu.au/Documents/Plant/flamekurrajong.htm
>http://selectree.calpoly.edu/treedetail.lasso?rid=213
Hole-in-one... that covers the golf content! Many thanks, Colin. The
pictures reminded me of the fact that a large area under the trees was
covered with bark chips. You're right, they were a spectacular sight!
By the way, the site was in a small town in Central Florida,
--
Loudon R. Briggs larebe@bbz.net Phoenix, AZ
"How Can You Not Like A Game Where It's Okay To
Get Teed Off, Tote A Six-Iron, Shoot Birdies,
and If You're Under Par It's A Great Day!"
(from "Frank & Ernest" by Bob Thaves -- used with permission)
|
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Date: 09 Oct 2006 06:27:24
From: Colin Wilson
Subject: Re: Course photographs
|
Loudon Briggs wrote:
> By the way, the site was in a small town in Central Florida,
Too cold for them where I live. They grow from north of Sydney
(Illawarra region, hence the name) to far north Queensland. That would
be a similar climate to Florida.
--
Cheers
Colin Wilson
------------------------------------------------------------------
Trentham Golf Club: http://www.trenthamgolf.com
Barnbougle Dunes: http://publishing.kyneton.net.au/barnbougle
------------------------------------------------------------------
|
| |
Date: 07 Oct 2006 17:42:13
From: Tex
Subject: Re: Course photographs
|
On 7, 7:24 pm, Chris Bellomy <p...@tbbqfubj.arg.invalid > wrote:
> Colin Wilson <nowh...@nospam.com> wrote:: And can someone tell me how to hit a golf ball successfully off a
> : blanket of pine needles?
>
> Thin.
Ball first, pine needles second...wait, that applies to almost every
shot :)
Tex
|
| |
Date: 07 Oct 2006 13:36:26
From: Bob Cotter
Subject: Re: Course photographs
|
In article <KLCVg.42668$rP1.11618@news-server.bigpond.net.au >,
Colin Wilson <nowhere@nospam.com > wrote:
> The photos are at http://publishing.kyneton.net.au/trentham/photos.html.
>
Great photos, Colin. Thanks for posting them.
Cheers... Bob
--
If replying by email, please remove the removes.
Visit my home course at <http://www.sunshinecoastgolf.com >
|
| |
Date: 08 Oct 2006 08:37:01
From: Birdie Bill
Subject: Re: Course photographs
|
On 7, 9:21 pm, long&left <nos...@diespammers.com > wrote:
> Colin Wilson wrote:
> > long&left wrote:
>
> >> in a State Park near where I live (Montana de Oro
> >>http://tinyurl.com/fgksg)
>
> > Nice spot.
>
> >> there is a 1400 acre parcel of what is now state of CA land that has
> >> row upon row of perfectly planted Eucalyptus trees. Story has it that
> >> back in the early 1900's a fellow decided that there was going to be a
> >> housing boom here. Well, he was right about that but unfortunately the
> >> Eucalyptus tree, at least the ones we have here, makes for lousy
> >> timber for building. So the trees remain as a tribute to an
> >> entrepreneurial failure
>
> > Blue gums can grow about 200+feet tall!
>
> > Hundred of thousands of hectares of leased farmland in my State are
> > being planted to blue gum plantations. They grow quickly and when cut
> > coppice again from the stumps. They can be harvested three times on a
> > 15-20 year rotation. They will be chipped in Japan for paper production
> > ... they make the world's best paper, something about cellulose fibre
> > length apparently. At least they're an alternative to felling State
> > forests.
>
> > We have some blue gums on my course ... you know the old story about
> > "ten years ago I could hit over that corner".I'll have to do some investigation into what type of trees Euc there are
> here. I didn't realize that there were different types of "weeds" :)
Plant racist! I believe Eucalyptus trees in California are mostly what
Colin
would call blue gum.
http://wwwlibrary.csustan.edu/bsantos/euctoc.htm
|
| | |
Date: 08 Oct 2006 12:57:38
From: long&left
Subject: Re: Course photographs
|
Birdie Bill wrote:
>
> On 7, 9:21 pm, long&left <nos...@diespammers.com> wrote:
>> Colin Wilson wrote:
>>> long&left wrote:
>>>> in a State Park near where I live (Montana de Oro
>>>> http://tinyurl.com/fgksg)
>>> Nice spot.
>>>> there is a 1400 acre parcel of what is now state of CA land that has
>>>> row upon row of perfectly planted Eucalyptus trees. Story has it that
>>>> back in the early 1900's a fellow decided that there was going to be a
>>>> housing boom here. Well, he was right about that but unfortunately the
>>>> Eucalyptus tree, at least the ones we have here, makes for lousy
>>>> timber for building. So the trees remain as a tribute to an
>>>> entrepreneurial failure
>>> Blue gums can grow about 200+feet tall!
>>> Hundred of thousands of hectares of leased farmland in my State are
>>> being planted to blue gum plantations. They grow quickly and when cut
>>> coppice again from the stumps. They can be harvested three times on a
>>> 15-20 year rotation. They will be chipped in Japan for paper production
>>> ... they make the world's best paper, something about cellulose fibre
>>> length apparently. At least they're an alternative to felling State
>>> forests.
>>> We have some blue gums on my course ... you know the old story about
>>> "ten years ago I could hit over that corner".I'll have to do some investigation into what type of trees Euc there are
>> here. I didn't realize that there were different types of "weeds" :)
>
> Plant racist! I believe Eucalyptus trees in California are mostly what
> Colin
> would call blue gum.
>
> http://wwwlibrary.csustan.edu/bsantos/euctoc.htm
>
sorry, but you know Euc's having lived in CA. They're stinky, messy, and
worthless plants. They do keep fleas away though :)
Dave
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