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Date: 29 Oct 2006 19:18:05
From: annika1980
Subject: Congrats, Daniel Chokra!
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Nice 76 today, pard.
Way to shake off that opening 67 and go from first to worst.
You're the biggest choker on Tour. Get a real job.
Dunkin Donuts is hiring.
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Date: 29 Oct 2006 20:17:10
From: Dene
Subject: Re: Jesus was a Liberal!
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multi wrote:
> You are now essentially agreeing with my original post --- you say
> that before your revelation, you thought the Bible was gibberish, and
> after your revelation, no amount of logic or reasoning could persuade
> you that you are wrong.
Not exactly. I read a chapter a day from 5th grade until 7th. Don't
ask me why....I just did. It was my Grandmother's King James
version....full of "thee, thous, and ieths" On that date in May (my
freshman year), I opened it up, started reading, and it made sense. Of
course, I had a lot to learn and did so....it's ongoing, especially
since I'm not one to believe theology just because it's conventional.
>That's all I was saying --- that your faith
> is not based on reason, which is why they call it faith. I have read
> many attempts by Christian apologists (including CS Lewis) to prove
> the truth of Christianity without recourse to revelation, and IMO they
> all commit blatant logical errors. By far, the most common is the
> fallacy of undesired consequences --- some form of, "If there is no
> God, then our lives have no meaning." I dispute that, but even if it
> were true, it has no more effect on the universe than me saying, "My
> car battery can't be dead, because I have to be at the airport in
> twenty minutes." Trust me, it can be dead.
Fair enough....what then gives your life meaning?
> So I agree with you. Now that we know that you are not depending on
> logic, then there is no point in pursuing logical argument. My logic
> is not sufficient to change your mind, and apparently your own logic
> will not help me make sense of the Bible, since it didn't even work
> for you without a revelation.
There is some degree of logic. Creation is accounted for. Mankind's
flaws. Our uniqueness (soul) compared to other life forms is
explained. And of course, purpose.
> I would like you to do me a favor, though, and tell me about your
> minute-to-minute relationship with God. I have heard about this from
> a lot of Christians, especially when I was in college, but I have
> never found one who can demonstrate anything more than a reported
> buzz. I have always been told that the most important thing about any
> personal relationship is communication, but these divine relationships
> always seem to be strictly one-way, i.e. you can talk to God, but he
> doesn't answer you, except by events that may or may not happen,
> sooner or later.
It's easier to explain a golf swing than it is to explain this, and
trust me, I'm not good at that. The best way I can put it is an
ongoing presence. A warmth within, magnified when I'm at church or
worshipping on my own. Minimized when I'm angry or swapping porn with
Annika. (I'm joking). Regardless, it's always there. I feel it now,
yesterday, always. Summer of 2003, I experienced some deep depression
and heartache, but I never was alone. I felt his hand each time I was
curled up in a corner. Looking back, I now see the reason for all
this, and I thank Him for it. My wife wouldn't have married the man I
was before.
As for communication, I've never experienced or expect to experience
hearing His literal voice. However, I've experienced epiphanies, where
confusion becomes crystal clear. One of these experiences occured when
I confronted an influential, manipulative man about abusing his
daughter. I was just 25...wet behind the ears, completely on my own,
but knew what to say and when to say it. It was powerful.
I don't want to presume that these experiences are unique to
Christians. My father, a true Northwest Heathen, told me of an
experience he had with God when he was fly fishing. The only
distinction I have is that my relationship is ongoing....perpetual, not
limited to "Bible Camp" highs or serenity with nature.
> I remember one Christian friend of mine in college that I hadn't seen
> for a while, and I asked him how his pre-med studies were going. He
> said that God had told him to change his major. I was excited to hear
> about it, because he would have been the first person I knew who
> actually claimed that God had spoken to him in unambiguous language.
> But as it turned out, God had not spoken to him, but instead chose to
> indicate His will by giving him an F on his biology test.
I know what you mean. I run into this all the time, especially among
Pentecostals. I think it's rare for God to give people specific
revelation as to their life's direction. When you read about Paul's
life in Acts, there were plenty of times when he operated on his own,
and that's what God intends. He wants us to be free....not caught up
in nonsense about what kind of car to buy.
> So, with all respect, is what you have really a personal relationship,
> or is it more along the lines of a good feeling?
Personal. Feelings come and go. His presence has been with me since
1973. Prior to that, a gnawing sense of emptiness.
-Greg
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Date: 30 Oct 2006 01:29:31
From: multi
Subject: Re: Jesus was a Liberal!
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On 29 2006 20:17:10 -0800, "Dene" <gdstrue@aol.com > wrote:
><Multi wrote:>
>> So, with all respect, is what you have really a personal relationship,
>> or is it more along the lines of a good feeling?
>
>Personal. Feelings come and go. His presence has been with me since
>1973. Prior to that, a gnawing sense of emptiness.
Well, you said it was hard to explain, but the way you explained it,
it sure sounds more like a good feeling to me. But that's good,
because I would question your sanity if you said that God actually
talked to you.
I'll end it here, but I would ask you to seriously consider whether
you see a contradiction in the fact that although he obviously could,
God doesn't seem to talk to anyone, or at least not anyone very
credible. The Bible is full of accounts of him talking to people
about all kinds of things, and even actively forcing them to do things
(e.g. Jonah), yet somehow Christians today act like God is much too
polite to give anything beyond the most subtle hint, even though many
of them believe that he has already sentenced billions of people to
eternal torment.
I think you should ask yourself which is more probable, given the
undeniable fact that millions (or billions) of people, of all
different faiths, are sure that they are in touch with God, and yet
only the lunatics offer testable proof, i.e. only they are willing to
say that God has revealed to them that X will happen in the future.
Has God really changed his nature so much since the Biblical days when
he spoke unambiguously to those he had a personal relationship with,
or is it more likely that what you feel is simply part of an innate
human need to be part of something larger than yourself?
In fact, forget all the other religions, and just take Christianity.
I have in mind the two most famous Christians of 2003, namely George
W. Bush, and Pope John Paul II. Both claimed a close personal
relationship with God. And yet, after careful and prayerful
consideration, Bush believed that God told him to invade Iraq, while
the Pope believed that God told him the invasion was wrong. Was God
lying to one of them? Was one of them deceived by Satan? Or were both
of them just deceiving themselves?
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Date: 30 Oct 2006 10:15:31
From: dugjustdug
Subject: Re: Congrats, Daniel Chokra!
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mmmmmmmm... Doooo-nuuuuttttssss....
On 29, 7:18 pm, "annika1980" <annika1...@aol.com > wrote:
> Nice 76 today, pard.
>
> Way to shake off that opening 67 and go from first to worst.
> You're the biggest choker on Tour. Get a real job.
> Dunkin Donuts is hiring.
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Date: 30 Oct 2006 14:36:11
From:
Subject: Re: Congrats, Daniel Chokra!
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On 29 2006 19:18:05 -0800, "annika1980" <annika1980@aol.com >
wrote:
>Nice 76 today, pard.
>
>Way to shake off that opening 67 and go from first to worst.
>You're the biggest choker on Tour. Get a real job.
>Dunkin Donuts is hiring.
So, where are we playing?
--
jvdp
http://www.rsgincinnati.com
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Date: 31 Oct 2006 05:34:54
From: bill-o
Subject: Re: Congrats, Daniel Chokra!
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On 30--2006, nospammymywhammy@ugh.com wrote:
> >Nice 76 today, pard.
> >
> >Way to shake off that opening 67 and go from first to worst.
> >You're the biggest choker on Tour. Get a real job.
> >Dunkin Donuts is hiring.
>
> So, where are we playing?
Bring a closepin! ;-)
--
bill-o
A "gimme" can best be defined as an agreement between
two golfers neither of whom can putt very well.
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Date: 31 Oct 2006 17:00:03
From: annika1980
Subject: Re: Congrats, Daniel Chokra!
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nospammymywhammy@ugh.com wrote:
>
> So, where are we playing?
> --
>
> jvdp
> http://www.rsgincinnati.com
Kapalua. When's good for you?
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Date: 01 Nov 2006 10:32:54
From: John van der Pflum
Subject: Re: Congrats, Daniel Chokra!
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On 31 2006 17:00:03 -0800, "annika1980" <annika1980@aol.com >
wrote:
>
>nospammymywhammy@ugh.com wrote:
>>
>> So, where are we playing?
>> --
>>
>> jvdp
>> http://www.rsgincinnati.com
>
>Kapalua. When's good for you?
Send me the plane ticket and I'll be there.
--
jvdp
http://www.rsgincinnati.com
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Date: 01 Nov 2006 10:00:21
From: annika1980
Subject: Re: Congrats, Daniel Chokra!
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John van der Pflum wrote:
>> >I believe the deal was greens fee only.
>
> Ok, then let's play Valhalla. I can actually get us a tee time there.
> --
Only if Rick DeMent plays and I can use my Clanger.
<end obscure RSG-ATL 2K2 reference >
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Date: 01 Nov 2006 13:46:45
From: John van der Pflum
Subject: Re: Congrats, Daniel Chokra!
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On 1 Nov 2006 10:00:21 -0800, "annika1980" <annika1980@aol.com > wrote:
>
>John van der Pflum wrote:
>>> >I believe the deal was greens fee only.
>>
>> Ok, then let's play Valhalla. I can actually get us a tee time there.
>> --
>
>Only if Rick DeMent plays and I can use my Clanger.
>
><end obscure RSG-ATL 2K2 reference>
I'll let you use it on the first tee after that it's non-conforming
and you can't use it but it still counts as one of your clubs.
BTW -- that comment by Rick Dement was one of the funniest things I
have ever witnesses. Classic.
--
jvdp
http://www.rsgincinnati.com
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Date: 01 Nov 2006 20:45:28
From: Peter Strauss
Subject: Re: Congrats, Daniel Chokra!
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On 1 Nov 2006 10:00:21 -0800, "annika1980" <annika1980@aol.com > wrote:
>
> John van der Pflum wrote:
> >> >I believe the deal was greens fee only.
> >
> > Ok, then let's play Valhalla. I can actually get us a tee time there.
> > --
>
> Only if Rick DeMent plays and I can use my Clanger.
>
> <end obscure RSG-ATL 2K2 reference>
And one I can actually follow, trace and remember.
In fact, my reactions to some shots were the stimulus for his
observations, at Trophy Club, as I recall, in the Sunday round.
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Date: 01 Nov 2006 09:42:19
From: Tex
Subject: Re: Congrats, Daniel Chokra!
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John van der Pflum wrote:
> On 1 Nov 2006 08:51:09 -0800, "annika1980" <annika1980@aol.com> wrote:
>
> >
> >John van der Pflum wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> So, where are we playing?
> >> >> --
> >> >
> >> >Kapalua. When's good for you?
> >>
> >> Send me the plane ticket and I'll be there.
> >> --
> >
> >I believe the deal was greens fee only.
>
> Ok, then let's play Valhalla. I can actually get us a tee time there.
Need a caddie?
Tex
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Date: 01 Nov 2006 13:45:28
From: John van der Pflum
Subject: Re: Congrats, Daniel Chokra!
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On 1 Nov 2006 09:42:19 -0800, "Tex" <marktexkoenig@gmail.com > wrote:
>
>John van der Pflum wrote:
>> On 1 Nov 2006 08:51:09 -0800, "annika1980" <annika1980@aol.com> wrote:
>>
>> >
>> >John van der Pflum wrote:
>> >> >>
>> >> >> So, where are we playing?
>> >> >> --
>> >> >
>> >> >Kapalua. When's good for you?
>> >>
>> >> Send me the plane ticket and I'll be there.
>> >> --
>> >
>> >I believe the deal was greens fee only.
>>
>> Ok, then let's play Valhalla. I can actually get us a tee time there.
>
>Need a caddie?
>
>Tex
Of course wouldn't you rather play?
--
jvdp
http://www.rsgincinnati.com
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Date: 01 Nov 2006 08:51:09
From: annika1980
Subject: Re: Congrats, Daniel Chokra!
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John van der Pflum wrote:
> >>
> >> So, where are we playing?
> >> --
> >
> >Kapalua. When's good for you?
>
> Send me the plane ticket and I'll be there.
> --
I believe the deal was greens fee only.
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Date: 01 Nov 2006 12:33:52
From: John van der Pflum
Subject: Re: Congrats, Daniel Chokra!
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On 1 Nov 2006 08:51:09 -0800, "annika1980" <annika1980@aol.com > wrote:
>
>John van der Pflum wrote:
>> >>
>> >> So, where are we playing?
>> >> --
>> >
>> >Kapalua. When's good for you?
>>
>> Send me the plane ticket and I'll be there.
>> --
>
>I believe the deal was greens fee only.
Ok, then let's play Valhalla. I can actually get us a tee time there.
--
jvdp
http://www.rsgincinnati.com
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Date: 01 Nov 2006 13:13:35
From: Tex
Subject: Re: Congrats, Daniel Chokra!
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John van der Pflum wrote:
> On 1 Nov 2006 09:42:19 -0800, "Tex" <marktexkoenig@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >
> >John van der Pflum wrote:
> >> On 1 Nov 2006 08:51:09 -0800, "annika1980" <annika1980@aol.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> >
> >> >John van der Pflum wrote:
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> So, where are we playing?
> >> >> >> --
> >> >> >
> >> >> >Kapalua. When's good for you?
> >> >>
> >> >> Send me the plane ticket and I'll be there.
> >> >> --
> >> >
> >> >I believe the deal was greens fee only.
> >>
> >> Ok, then let's play Valhalla. I can actually get us a tee time there.
> >
> >Need a caddie?
> >
> >Tex
>
> Of course wouldn't you rather play?
I don't have the time to play anymore...but a loop is easy :)
Tex
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Date: 01 Nov 2006 20:19:48
From: John van der Pflum
Subject: Re: Congrats, Daniel Chokra!
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On 1 Nov 2006 13:13:35 -0800, "Tex" <marktexkoenig@gmail.com > wrote:
>
>John van der Pflum wrote:
>> On 1 Nov 2006 09:42:19 -0800, "Tex" <marktexkoenig@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> >
>> >John van der Pflum wrote:
>> >> On 1 Nov 2006 08:51:09 -0800, "annika1980" <annika1980@aol.com> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> >
>> >> >John van der Pflum wrote:
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> So, where are we playing?
>> >> >> >> --
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >Kapalua. When's good for you?
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Send me the plane ticket and I'll be there.
>> >> >> --
>> >> >
>> >> >I believe the deal was greens fee only.
>> >>
>> >> Ok, then let's play Valhalla. I can actually get us a tee time there.
>> >
>> >Need a caddie?
>> >
>> >Tex
>>
>> Of course wouldn't you rather play?
>
>I don't have the time to play anymore...but a loop is easy :)
>
>Tex
With you on the bag I'll probably shoot a 68 that should be a 66
because Annika won't keep his lips off my balls.
--
jvdp
http://www.rsgincinnati.com
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Date: 02 Nov 2006 01:38:40
From: Peter Strauss
Subject: Re: Congrats, Daniel Chokra!
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On Wed, 01 Nov 2006 20:19:48 -0500, John van der Pflum
<nowhammymyspammy@bite.org > wrote:
> On 1 Nov 2006 13:13:35 -0800, "Tex" <marktexkoenig@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >I don't have the time to play anymore...but a loop is easy :)
> >
> >Tex
>
> With you on the bag I'll probably shoot a 68 that should be a 66
> because Annika won't keep his lips off my balls.
Please don't explain this, for the sake of decency.
But do post pictures.
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Date: 02 Nov 2006 09:06:15
From: BigPurdueFan
Subject: Re: Congrats, Daniel Chokra!
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> >I believe the deal was greens fee only.
>
> Ok, then let's play Valhalla. I can actually get us a tee time there.
> --
>
> jvdp
> http://www.rsgincinnati.com
My father-in-law keeps saying he's going to get us on there too, but he
has yet to deliver. You got friends down here? (Louisville area)
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Date: 02 Nov 2006 12:36:00
From: John van der Pflum
Subject: Re: Congrats, Daniel Chokra!
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On 2 Nov 2006 09:06:15 -0800, "BigPurdueFan" <bigpufan@aol.com > wrote:
>
>> >I believe the deal was greens fee only.
>>
>> Ok, then let's play Valhalla. I can actually get us a tee time there.
>> --
>>
>> jvdp
>> http://www.rsgincinnati.com
>
>My father-in-law keeps saying he's going to get us on there too, but he
>has yet to deliver. You got friends down here? (Louisville area)
I have a buddy who belongs to a Jack Nicklaus Signature Course in
Indianapolis. Along with that he gets privileges at all other Jack
Nicklaus Signature courses. Valhalla, Muirfield Village, etc.
--
jvdp
http://www.rsgincinnati.com
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Date: 02 Nov 2006 11:31:26
From: BigPurdueFan
Subject: Re: Congrats, Daniel Chokra!
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John van der Pflum wrote:
> On 2 Nov 2006 10:57:50 -0800, "BigPurdueFan" <bigpufan@aol.com> wrote:
>
> >
> >> >My father-in-law keeps saying he's going to get us on there too, but he
> >> >has yet to deliver. You got friends down here? (Louisville area)
> >>
> >> I have a buddy who belongs to a Jack Nicklaus Signature Course in
> >> Indianapolis. Along with that he gets privileges at all other Jack
> >> Nicklaus Signature courses. Valhalla, Muirfield Village, etc.
> >> --
> >>
> >> jvdp
> >> http://www.rsgincinnati.com
> >
> >Ah, it's good to have friends like that.
> >
> >Btw, I assume you know your sig has a typo?
>
> What typo?
> --
>
> jvdp
> http://www.rsgcincinnati.com
Looks good now!
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Date: 02 Nov 2006 10:57:50
From: BigPurdueFan
Subject: Re: Congrats, Daniel Chokra!
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> >My father-in-law keeps saying he's going to get us on there too, but he
> >has yet to deliver. You got friends down here? (Louisville area)
>
> I have a buddy who belongs to a Jack Nicklaus Signature Course in
> Indianapolis. Along with that he gets privileges at all other Jack
> Nicklaus Signature courses. Valhalla, Muirfield Village, etc.
> --
>
> jvdp
> http://www.rsgincinnati.com
Ah, it's good to have friends like that.
Btw, I assume you know your sig has a typo?
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Date: 02 Nov 2006 14:28:48
From: John van der Pflum
Subject: Re: Congrats, Daniel Chokra!
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On 2 Nov 2006 10:57:50 -0800, "BigPurdueFan" <bigpufan@aol.com > wrote:
>
>> >My father-in-law keeps saying he's going to get us on there too, but he
>> >has yet to deliver. You got friends down here? (Louisville area)
>>
>> I have a buddy who belongs to a Jack Nicklaus Signature Course in
>> Indianapolis. Along with that he gets privileges at all other Jack
>> Nicklaus Signature courses. Valhalla, Muirfield Village, etc.
>> --
>>
>> jvdp
>> http://www.rsgincinnati.com
>
>Ah, it's good to have friends like that.
>
>Btw, I assume you know your sig has a typo?
What typo?
--
jvdp
http://www.rsgcincinnati.com
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