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Date: 18 Aug 2006 04:46:21
From: rich
Subject: A (not so) modest proposal
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Is it just me that it seems strange that we are watching a tournament that
purports to be a championship of an organization that most of the
participating players do not belong to, except perhaps by courtesy? It has
been some time since the PGA and the PGA Tour parted ways. The PGA is club
pros and the PGA Tour is playing pros.
The PGA championship should be given back to the club pros and receded into
obscurity and the PGA Tour should create a new major (and take over the
Ryder Cup, as an aside).
While the Players Championship is considered the 5th major, I would
personally like to see the new one of the 4 majors revert to match play. It
is a legitimate form of golf and one that should be represented in the
majors. And it was for much of the PGA's history. I'd like to see a
tournament in which there is a 2 round medal play competition and the top 32
get into the match play round. Start with medal play rounds on Wednesday
and Thursday. Then on Friday a draw is established with seedings based on
medal scores. If there is a tie for the last spots then there is a medal
round playoff. Then on Friday the 18-hole matches begin. Two matches a
day, so after Friday we are down to the elite 8, and after Saturday we are
down to the 2 finalists. Sunday is a 36 hole finals along with a 36 hole
match for 3rd place.
If match play was good enough for Walter Hagen then it is good enough for
today's players. I think it is important to point out that back in the
golden age both the amateur and professional championships were decided by
match play. It was only the Open championships that were decided by stroke
play. Right now the PGA has a problem as the 4th major in that there is
nothing to distinguish it. The Masters is a tribute to a man who will
always have an arguable claim to the greatest of all time. The British Open
is classic links golf at the birthplace of golf. The US Open has evolved
into the severest test of the penal style of golf. And the PGA is nothing
special. By making it the championship of the PGA Tour and changing it to
the original way of determining the champion of the pro ranks, the new major
would have distinguishing characteristics that in time would enhance its
prestige and make it far more meaningful than the PGA as currently
constituted.
Comments?
Rich
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Date: 18 Aug 2006 05:12:32
From: Chris Bellomy
Subject: Re: A (not so) modest proposal
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rich <dummy@nothere.com > wrote:
: Is it just me that it seems strange that we are watching a tournament that
: purports to be a championship of an organization that most of the
: participating players do not belong to, except perhaps by courtesy? It has
: been some time since the PGA and the PGA Tour parted ways. The PGA is club
: pros and the PGA Tour is playing pros.
:
: The PGA championship should be given back to the club pros and receded into
: obscurity and the PGA Tour should create a new major (and take over the
: Ryder Cup, as an aside).
:
: While the Players Championship is considered the 5th major,
Not universally.
: I would
: personally like to see the new one of the 4 majors revert to match play. It
: is a legitimate form of golf and one that should be represented in the
: majors. And it was for much of the PGA's history. I'd like to see a
: tournament in which there is a 2 round medal play competition and the top 32
: get into the match play round. Start with medal play rounds on Wednesday
: and Thursday. Then on Friday a draw is established with seedings based on
: medal scores. If there is a tie for the last spots then there is a medal
: round playoff. Then on Friday the 18-hole matches begin. Two matches a
: day, so after Friday we are down to the elite 8, and after Saturday we are
: down to the 2 finalists. Sunday is a 36 hole finals along with a 36 hole
: match for 3rd place.
:
: If match play was good enough for Walter Hagen then it is good enough for
: today's players. I think it is important to point out that back in the
: golden age both the amateur and professional championships were decided by
: match play. It was only the Open championships that were decided by stroke
: play. Right now the PGA has a problem as the 4th major in that there is
: nothing to distinguish it. The Masters is a tribute to a man who will
: always have an arguable claim to the greatest of all time. The British Open
: is classic links golf at the birthplace of golf. The US Open has evolved
: into the severest test of the penal style of golf. And the PGA is nothing
: special. By making it the championship of the PGA Tour and changing it to
: the original way of determining the champion of the pro ranks, the new major
: would have distinguishing characteristics that in time would enhance its
: prestige and make it far more meaningful than the PGA as currently
: constituted.
:
: Comments?
Seems to me that you have two separate issues: the governing
body of the fourth major, and the format. I'll take the latter
first: I'd like to see the PGA go back to match play, too. So
no argument there.
On the former point, though, I see it this way: the PGA of
America plays its championship mostly on US Open rota courses
but with less severe setups. I like seeing courses like Winged
Foot and Medinah set up differently, to see what a difference
course condition has on scoring. Plus, many believe that the
style of golf at the PGA is superior to what one sees at the
US Open -- it's definitely different from any of the other
majors.
I'd go so far as to say that in recent years, the PGA has done
the best job of any of the four of rewarding skill over luck.
That's no small thing.
In contrast, imagine the PGA Tour with a major on its hands.
This is a body that imagines that TPC Sawgrass is a good golf
course for holding its marquee event. Please. That course is
a windmill and a clown's head away from being honest. That
tournament is a bounce and wind lottery, and I have never
given a tinker's damn who won there because of this. So please
let's not let that screwball organization govern something we
call a major championship, they have proven already that they
have no idea what to do with a premier Tour event.
--
Chris Bellomy
C-List Charter Member
http://clist.org/
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Date: 18 Aug 2006 14:36:11
From: rich
Subject: Re: A (not so) modest proposal
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"Chris Bellomy" <puevf@tbbqfubj.arg.invalid > wrote in message
news:0T3d66ccIh6qN34@redshark.goodshow.net...
> Seems to me that you have two separate issues: the governing
> body of the fourth major, and the format. I'll take the latter
> first: I'd like to see the PGA go back to match play, too. So
> no argument there.
You're right. And my organizational point is not so much a criticism of how
the PGA championship has been done so much as feeling like it is time to
recognize the split has made the notion of the PGA championship being the
championship of the PGA illogical. It smacks of the same kind of illogic
that led the LPGA to invite an amateur into its tournament to decide its
championship. How many country clubs invite non-members to play for their
championships? Would it still be the NBA championship if 12 of the 16
playoff teams were non-NBA teams from Europe?
It also seems like the premier PGA tournament organization should run one
major. But your points about the PGA Tour's questionable choices and
preparation of courses are well taken. And I would want the new major to be
one that is not anchored at one course but has its own rota.
Rich
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Date: 18 Aug 2006 06:19:57
From: Harrison Bergeron
Subject: Re: A (not so) modest proposal
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Chris Bellomy <puevf@tbbqfubj.arg.invalid > writes:
> In contrast, imagine the PGA Tour with a major on its hands.
> This is a body that imagines that TPC Sawgrass is a good golf
> course for holding its marquee event. Please. That course is
> a windmill and a clown's head away from being honest. That
> tournament is a bounce and wind lottery, and I have never
> given a tinker's damn who won there because of this. So please
> let's not let that screwball organization govern something we
> call a major championship, they have proven already that they
> have no idea what to do with a premier Tour event.
They know what to do with a premier event -- use it
to market their golf course.
Making the cash register ring at TPC courses is
pretty high on the list of goals.
--
<-- Harry -- >
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Date: 18 Aug 2006 12:42:36
From: Chris Bellomy
Subject: Re: A (not so) modest proposal
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Harrison Bergeron <not_a_valid@address.com > wrote:
: Chris Bellomy <puevf@tbbqfubj.arg.invalid > writes:
:
: > In contrast, imagine the PGA Tour with a major on its hands.
: > This is a body that imagines that TPC Sawgrass is a good golf
: > course for holding its marquee event. Please. That course is
: > a windmill and a clown's head away from being honest. That
: > tournament is a bounce and wind lottery, and I have never
: > given a tinker's damn who won there because of this. So please
: > let's not let that screwball organization govern something we
: > call a major championship, they have proven already that they
: > have no idea what to do with a premier Tour event.
:
: They know what to do with a premier event -- use it
: to market their golf course.
:
: Making the cash register ring at TPC courses is
: pretty high on the list of goals.
OK, that's true.
--
Chris Bellomy
C-List Charter Member
http://clist.org/
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Date: 18 Aug 2006 15:08:15
From: laura bush - VEHICULAR HOMICIDE
Subject: Re: A (not so) modest proposal
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On Fri, 18 Aug 2006 04:46:21 GMT, "rich" <dummy@nothere.com > wrote:
>
>If match play was good enough for Walter Hagen then it is good enough for
>today's players.
Brilliant argument. Absolutely brilliant.
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Date: 18 Aug 2006 11:56:55
From: Howard Brazee
Subject: Re: A (not so) modest proposal
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On Fri, 18 Aug 2006 04:46:21 GMT, "rich" <dummy@nothere.com > wrote:
>If match play was good enough for Walter Hagen then it is good enough for
>today's players. I think it is important to point out that back in the
>golden age both the amateur and professional championships were decided by
>match play. It was only the Open championships that were decided by stroke
>play. Right now the PGA has a problem as the 4th major in that there is
>nothing to distinguish it.
I like this. How did they do this before 1958? Did they have 64
players with a format like The Players'?
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Date: 18 Aug 2006 12:41:39
From: Chris Bellomy
Subject: Re: A (not so) modest proposal
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Howard Brazee <howard@brazee.net > wrote:
: On Fri, 18 Aug 2006 04:46:21 GMT, "rich" <dummy@nothere.com > wrote:
:
: >If match play was good enough for Walter Hagen then it is good enough for
: >today's players. I think it is important to point out that back in the
: >golden age both the amateur and professional championships were decided by
: >match play. It was only the Open championships that were decided by stroke
: >play. Right now the PGA has a problem as the 4th major in that there is
: >nothing to distinguish it.
:
: I like this. How did they do this before 1958? Did they have 64
: players with a format like The Players'?
Two days of stroke play (Tuesday and Wednesday, IIRC) followed
by three days of match play. I'm not sure where they cut the
field for match play.
--
Chris Bellomy
C-List Charter Member
http://clist.org/
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Date: 18 Aug 2006 22:02:08
From: Howard Brazee
Subject: Re: A (not so) modest proposal
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On Fri, 18 Aug 2006 12:41:39 GMT, Chris Bellomy
<puevf@tbbqfubj.arg.invalid > wrote:
>: I like this. How did they do this before 1958? Did they have 64
>: players with a format like The Players'?
>
>Two days of stroke play (Tuesday and Wednesday, IIRC) followed
>by three days of match play. I'm not sure where they cut the
>field for match play.
That makes sense. 64 players wouldn't allow for local pros, and 128
players makes for too long of a tournament.
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Date: 18 Aug 2006 13:05:34
From: Larry Bud
Subject: Re: A (not so) modest proposal
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> If match play was good enough for Walter Hagen then it is good enough for
> today's players. I think it is important to point out that back in the
> golden age both the amateur and professional championships were decided by
> match play.
That's because they weren't on TV. Let's face it, match play just
isn't conducive to TV viewing when you get down to the final couple of
matches. When you have only 4 or 2 players on the course, there's just
too much dead air. Man, you think guys in RSG complain about the crap
announcers come up with now, just wait til a 36 hole final match!
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