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Main
Date: 04 Mar 2007 07:25:53
From: Felice
Subject: Practice mats
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I have read numerous times that one should avoid using "mats" for their
practice sessions, however, the course near to me does not have any other
option.
My frustration results from being able to strike the ball quite well during
practice, but when I play a round of golf, I look like I have never picked
up a club before.
I am trying to determine if this is a result of a mental breakdown or is it
just that much easier to hit off of those mats?
Any thoughts or comments?
Thanks in advance.
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Date: 05 Mar 2007 14:58:01
From: David
Subject: Re: Practice mats
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On Sun, 4 2007 07:25:53 -0800, "Felice" <delcolle@socal.rr.com >
wrote:
>I have read numerous times that one should avoid using "mats" for their
>practice sessions, however, the course near to me does not have any other
>option.
>
>My frustration results from being able to strike the ball quite well during
>practice, but when I play a round of golf, I look like I have never picked
>up a club before.
>
>I am trying to determine if this is a result of a mental breakdown or is it
>just that much easier to hit off of those mats?
>
>Any thoughts or comments?
I have comments, but so many were made already. The biggest problem
has been pointed out, mats are very forgiving. Have you ever
practised on mats and hit the ball "great," then headed out to the
golfcourse and hit everything fat? That is a direct result of hitting
off of the mats.
You should consider mats to be more of a warmup than an actual
practice session. If you cannot do so already, learn to feel how you
hit the ball, instead of watching the result.
>Thanks in advance.
>
David
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Date: 05 Mar 2007 07:18:02
From: Felice
Subject: Re: Practice mats
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Dave,
Your rhetorical question about hitting great at the range, then hitting tons
of fat shots on the course describes my problem exactly. I really need to
correct this or the frustration will drive me out of the game.
Thanks for your time and your comments.
"David" <dgold1958@yahoo.de > wrote in message
news:ja8ou2l9422m0oadpu8rngiqojok21f5m2@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 4 2007 07:25:53 -0800, "Felice" <delcolle@socal.rr.com>
> wrote:
>
> >I have read numerous times that one should avoid using "mats" for their
> >practice sessions, however, the course near to me does not have any other
> >option.
> >
> >My frustration results from being able to strike the ball quite well
during
> >practice, but when I play a round of golf, I look like I have never
picked
> >up a club before.
> >
> >I am trying to determine if this is a result of a mental breakdown or is
it
> >just that much easier to hit off of those mats?
> >
> >Any thoughts or comments?
>
> I have comments, but so many were made already. The biggest problem
> has been pointed out, mats are very forgiving. Have you ever
> practised on mats and hit the ball "great," then headed out to the
> golfcourse and hit everything fat? That is a direct result of hitting
> off of the mats.
>
> You should consider mats to be more of a warmup than an actual
> practice session. If you cannot do so already, learn to feel how you
> hit the ball, instead of watching the result.
>
> >Thanks in advance.
> >
> David
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Date: 05 Mar 2007 19:46:29
From: David
Subject: Re: Practice mats
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On Mon, 5 2007 07:18:02 -0800, "Felice" <delcolle@socal.rr.com >
wrote:
>Dave,
>
>Your rhetorical question about hitting great at the range, then hitting tons
>of fat shots on the course describes my problem exactly. I really need to
>correct this or the frustration will drive me out of the game.
>
>Thanks for your time and your comments.
You are going to have to find a range where you can hit off the
turf. There will be no way for you to determine that you are hitting
fat when you are hitting off of the mats--unless you really can "feel"
the hit. For the vast majority of beginners, this will not be
possible.
When I would get ready to play tournaments and had to hit off of
mats, I would do it mostly to loosen up and not concentrate on where
the ball went and how it got there. I do have the advantage that I
have been playing golf my entire life and can feel when the hit was
off.
If you are hitting a lot of fat shots, a swing key that may help you
would be to feel that the right shoulder was staying high during the
swing. This is what I would concentrate on if I was hitting fat shots
and it always helped. The shoulder will find the correct position and
it will help you to prevent from dropping the right side. You should
also try and maintain the body angle at set up throughout the swing.
David
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Date: 05 Mar 2007 18:52:16
From: Bob
Subject: Re: Practice mats
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"David" <dgold1958@yahoo.de > wrote in message
news:atoou299i9m8dashishbcdk5sdeqnbd7pl@4ax.com...
> On Mon, 5 2007 07:18:02 -0800, "Felice" <delcolle@socal.rr.com>
> wrote:
<snip >
> There will be no way for you to determine that you are hitting
> fat when you are hitting off of the mats--unless you really can "feel"
> the hit. For the vast majority of beginners, this will not be
> possible.
You can hear a fat shot too ... but again, tough for a beginner ... it's
that old 'thump ... click' that is a fat shot.
Bob
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Date: 05 Mar 2007 05:56:49
From: oconnell@slr.orl.lmco.com
Subject: Re: Practice mats
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On 5, 12:29 am, "Otto" <ottondebREMOVE%$#%^%$@@bellsouth.net >
wrote:
> "Tom K" <tkani...@optonline.net> wrote in message
>
> news:QkNGh.5206$wS3.18@newsfe12.lga...
>
> > Lack of skill doesn't keep you from placing your next practice ball a half
> > inch behind the back edge of the last divot that you took.
>
> A big part of it is education.
>
> A large percentage of people on golf courses need to be taught many of the
> unwritten aspects of golf:
A couple of courses I play have displayed on the golf cart (either
the gps display or just that plastic advertising space) instructions
on
both repairing divots and repairing pitch ks. The USGA probably
ought to develope a program that covers a wide variety of these
topics you mention for just such venues. I've thought on occasion
that courses could put signs in tee boxes with sort of "rules quizes"
where the answers would be at the green. I was consulting the
score card at a course the other day to determine the status of a
ditch (it wasn't clear if it was OB or a hazard). It was about then
that it occured to me that there should probably just be a sign in
the ditch. Truth is that a course could probably "teach" alot of
rules by just having signs explaining how to take drops from
hazards, GUR, immovable obstructions, etc. You don't need one
at every hazard. Folks tend to play the same courses often enough
that they'd learn after a bit.
>
> How to place a ball on a practice range is just one.
>
> How to properly fix a ball divot on a putting surface.
>
> How not to hit into the group in front of them.
>
> How to properly fix a divot in a fairway.
>
> How to properly rake a sand trap.
>
> How to let a faster group play through.
>
> How to tend a flag.
>
> How to walk around the cup.
>
> It goes on and on.
>
> Somewhere along the line the junior programs have failed to teach the kids
> properly.
>
> In addition, I realize that many of the adult golfers simply fell into the
> game(did not play junior golf)and never had the opportunity to be properly
> trained.
>
> Perhaps it is a sign of our society in general?
>
> Otto
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Date: 05 Mar 2007 05:49:17
From: oconnell@slr.orl.lmco.com
Subject: Re: Practice mats
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On 4, 4:58 pm, David Geesaman <dgeesamanIHateS...@yahoo.com >
wrote:
> Tom K wrote:
> > "David Geesaman" <dgeesamanIHateS...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> >news:esf00c0129a@news2.newsguy.com...
> >> The proper way to use a grass practice area is to place your next ball on
> >> the grass just a fraction of an inch behind the last divot. Then with
> >> each successive shot you don't chop entire pelts of divot, and when you're
> >> done. The pros will clear out a 3' circle of turf, or simply a strip of
> >> divot-wide grass in a long stripe. This is much easier to refill with
> >> sand/seed and to avoid walking on until it's grown in.
>
> >> Dave
>
> > We were watching Paul Azinger 2 years ago at Baltusrol in NJ for the PGA
> > tournament. We were about 5 ft. away from him, when he was on the practice
> > range. He was doing exactly what you said. He'd put each new ball about a
> > half inch behind the last divot k that he made. And with each shot, he'd
> > take only that half inch of grass away. Next ball another half inch
> > behind... and he'd catch it perfectly. I think he was hitting about a 7I.
> > Since then I've tried doing that when I've had to chance to hit from a grass
> > practice area (Royce Brook in NJ has one).
>
> > --Tom
>
> And if you ask the greenkeeper if they think this helps, they will most
> certainly agree. The drop-and-chop people who leave a shotgun pattern
> of full divots simply destroy the grass, but all the greenkeepers I've
> talked to think that getting golfers to do this is just impossible.
>
> I've always thought that it wouldn't be too hard to explain this to
> folks at the range point-of-sale, and suggest that following this policy
> ensures the best grass for the lowest price. But the gk's I suggested
> this to just shrugged.
>
> Oh well if I had a practice range I know it would be that way. :)
I've thought on occasion that ranges ought to develop "mats" which
sat on the grass and only left a 6 inch wide area of grass exposed.
When you got your bucket, the implication was that the mat would
be placed and you'd be expected to hit out of the exposed area until
exhausted (the area that is, not ones self). It could be moved around
to encourage rapid regrowth of the grass and help control the
"drop and chops".
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Date: 04 Mar 2007 22:13:11
From: Howard Brazee
Subject: Re: Practice mats
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On Sun, 4 2007 07:25:53 -0800, "Felice" <delcolle@socal.rr.com >
wrote:
>I am trying to determine if this is a result of a mental breakdown or is it
>just that much easier to hit off of those mats?
It's *different* hitting off mats. But the better bet is the
difference is you. Two suggestions:
1. Call around and find someplace that lets you hit off the grass -
and find out the answer for yourself.
2. Create a pre-shot routine that is identical at the range as it is
on the course. This includes picking your target before you step up
to the ball. And sometimes even play a virtual round of golf on the
range. Pick a familiar course and figure out where the landing area
is on hole #1 and hit it to that landing area. Evaluate your shot
and decide where your ball landed and hit your approach shot (for a
par-4), with the appropriate club.
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Date: 04 Mar 2007 12:35:09
From: David Geesaman
Subject: Re: Practice mats
|
Felice wrote:
> I have read numerous times that one should avoid using "mats" for their
> practice sessions, however, the course near to me does not have any other
> option.
>
> My frustration results from being able to strike the ball quite well during
> practice, but when I play a round of golf, I look like I have never picked
> up a club before.
>
> I am trying to determine if this is a result of a mental breakdown or is it
> just that much easier to hit off of those mats?
Yes, particularly cushy or soft mats, are much easier to hit from. The
reason is that you don't need to use a decending impact to get a good
shot, and you can unknowingly build the habit of actually hitting the
ball on an upswing (hitting it fat). Of course, hitting it fat rarely
works on real turf.
When on mats I keep in touch with how fat/thin I'm hitting them. First,
look to see if the club leaves any visible k on the mat. Then take
careful note of the ball's location on the mat and compare the k
afterward. You want the back edge of the k to be where the ball was.
Another trick is to try and hit the ball without touching the mat. This
works better for fairway woods, which of course you won't take much if
any divot on grass.
> Any thoughts or comments?
I find that grass practice ranges are usually far too harsh. Every
single one I've ever used has had either a very sandy soil with
short/sparse grass (every shot becomes a bunker shot) or very lumpy
ground with short/sparse grass. The result is that you can't develop a
normal swing if you every shot requires you to chop down on the ball
with unusual precision. Sadly - half of this problem with bad range
grass is the golfers - they place a ball down at scattered locations,
and invariably take a full 4x6" divot for each one. And they don't use
the provided sand/seed to fill the divots. When it finally grows back
it results in a lumpy, thin, sparse mess.
The proper way to use a grass practice area is to place your next ball
on the grass just a fraction of an inch behind the last divot. Then
with each successive shot you don't chop entire pelts of divot, and when
you're done. The pros will clear out a 3' circle of turf, or simply a
strip of divot-wide grass in a long stripe. This is much easier to
refill with sand/seed and to avoid walking on until it's grown in.
Dave
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Date: 04 Mar 2007 14:34:46
From: Tom K
Subject: Re: Practice mats
|
"David Geesaman" <dgeesamanIHateSpam@yahoo.com > wrote in message
news:esf00c0129a@news2.newsguy.com...
>
> The proper way to use a grass practice area is to place your next ball on
> the grass just a fraction of an inch behind the last divot. Then with
> each successive shot you don't chop entire pelts of divot, and when you're
> done. The pros will clear out a 3' circle of turf, or simply a strip of
> divot-wide grass in a long stripe. This is much easier to refill with
> sand/seed and to avoid walking on until it's grown in.
>
> Dave
We were watching Paul Azinger 2 years ago at Baltusrol in NJ for the PGA
tournament. We were about 5 ft. away from him, when he was on the practice
range. He was doing exactly what you said. He'd put each new ball about a
half inch behind the last divot k that he made. And with each shot, he'd
take only that half inch of grass away. Next ball another half inch
behind... and he'd catch it perfectly. I think he was hitting about a 7I.
Since then I've tried doing that when I've had to chance to hit from a grass
practice area (Royce Brook in NJ has one).
--Tom
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Date: 04 Mar 2007 16:58:28
From: David Geesaman
Subject: Re: Practice mats
|
Tom K wrote:
> "David Geesaman" <dgeesamanIHateSpam@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:esf00c0129a@news2.newsguy.com...
>> The proper way to use a grass practice area is to place your next ball on
>> the grass just a fraction of an inch behind the last divot. Then with
>> each successive shot you don't chop entire pelts of divot, and when you're
>> done. The pros will clear out a 3' circle of turf, or simply a strip of
>> divot-wide grass in a long stripe. This is much easier to refill with
>> sand/seed and to avoid walking on until it's grown in.
>>
>> Dave
>
> We were watching Paul Azinger 2 years ago at Baltusrol in NJ for the PGA
> tournament. We were about 5 ft. away from him, when he was on the practice
> range. He was doing exactly what you said. He'd put each new ball about a
> half inch behind the last divot k that he made. And with each shot, he'd
> take only that half inch of grass away. Next ball another half inch
> behind... and he'd catch it perfectly. I think he was hitting about a 7I.
> Since then I've tried doing that when I've had to chance to hit from a grass
> practice area (Royce Brook in NJ has one).
>
> --Tom
And if you ask the greenkeeper if they think this helps, they will most
certainly agree. The drop-and-chop people who leave a shotgun pattern
of full divots simply destroy the grass, but all the greenkeepers I've
talked to think that getting golfers to do this is just impossible.
I've always thought that it wouldn't be too hard to explain this to
folks at the range point-of-sale, and suggest that following this policy
ensures the best grass for the lowest price. But the gk's I suggested
this to just shrugged.
Oh well if I had a practice range I know it would be that way. :)
Dave
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Date: 04 Mar 2007 22:17:04
From: Howard Brazee
Subject: Re: Practice mats
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On Sun, 04 2007 16:58:28 -0500, David Geesaman
<dgeesamanIHateSpam@yahoo.com > wrote:
>And if you ask the greenkeeper if they think this helps, they will most
>certainly agree. The drop-and-chop people who leave a shotgun pattern
>of full divots simply destroy the grass, but all the greenkeepers I've
>talked to think that getting golfers to do this is just impossible.
For some of us, it's impossible because of lack of skill. For
others, it is lack of consideration.
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Date: 04 Mar 2007 23:50:56
From: Tom K
Subject: Re: Practice mats
|
"Howard Brazee" <howard@brazee.net > wrote in message
news:s9hmu25n291ufta5h6aua8kadhg73tdaed@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 04 2007 16:58:28 -0500, David Geesaman
> <dgeesamanIHateSpam@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>>And if you ask the greenkeeper if they think this helps, they will most
>>certainly agree. The drop-and-chop people who leave a shotgun pattern
>>of full divots simply destroy the grass, but all the greenkeepers I've
>>talked to think that getting golfers to do this is just impossible.
>
> For some of us, it's impossible because of lack of skill. For
> others, it is lack of consideration.
Lack of skill doesn't keep you from placing your next practice ball a half
inch behind the back edge of the last divot that you took.
--Tom
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Date: 05 Mar 2007 12:53:13
From: Howard Brazee
Subject: Re: Practice mats
|
On Sun, 4 2007 23:50:56 -0500, "Tom K" <tkanitra@optonline.net >
wrote:
>> For some of us, it's impossible because of lack of skill. For
>> others, it is lack of consideration.
>
>Lack of skill doesn't keep you from placing your next practice ball a half
>inch behind the back edge of the last divot that you took.
But lack of skill can cause the result to the turf to be considerably
different from the Paul Azinger standard here.
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Date: 06 Mar 2007 02:24:43
From: Howard Brazee
Subject: Re: Practice mats
|
On Mon, 05 2007 12:53:13 GMT, Howard Brazee <howard@brazee.net >
wrote:
>>Lack of skill doesn't keep you from placing your next practice ball a half
>>inch behind the back edge of the last divot that you took.
>
>But lack of skill can cause the result to the turf to be considerably
>different from the Paul Azinger standard here.
I concentrated on getting the correct divot today at the range. I
scraped the grass a bit, hardly touched it most of the time, and had 3
big divots - in front of the ball.
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Date: 05 Mar 2007 00:29:35
From: Otto
Subject: Re: Practice mats
|
"Tom K" <tkanitra@optonline.net > wrote in message
news:QkNGh.5206$wS3.18@newsfe12.lga...
> Lack of skill doesn't keep you from placing your next practice ball a half
> inch behind the back edge of the last divot that you took.
A big part of it is education.
A large percentage of people on golf courses need to be taught many of the
unwritten aspects of golf:
How to place a ball on a practice range is just one.
How to properly fix a ball divot on a putting surface.
How not to hit into the group in front of them.
How to properly fix a divot in a fairway.
How to properly rake a sand trap.
How to let a faster group play through.
How to tend a flag.
How to walk around the cup.
It goes on and on.
Somewhere along the line the junior programs have failed to teach the kids
properly.
In addition, I realize that many of the adult golfers simply fell into the
game(did not play junior golf)and never had the opportunity to be properly
trained.
Perhaps it is a sign of our society in general?
Otto
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Date: 05 Mar 2007 11:35:01
From: John Reddy
Subject: Re: Practice mats
|
In article <0VNGh.2669$X6.1012@bignews1.bellsouth.net >,
"Otto" <ottondebREMOVE%$#%^%$@@bellsouth.net > wrote:
> Somewhere along the line the junior programs have failed to teach the kids
> properly.
I doubt that. What percentage of those with poor etiquette and boorish
behavior went through any kind of junior program? I would bet none.
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Date: 05 Mar 2007 06:49:11
From: Otto
Subject: Re: Practice mats
|
"John Reddy" <johnreddy@contbuilding.com > wrote in message
news:johnreddy-D50F5F.06350105032007@news.verizon.net...
> I doubt that. What percentage of those with poor etiquette and boorish
> behavior went through any kind of junior program? I would bet none.
I would guess you are correct.
Otto
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Date: 05 Mar 2007 06:20:59
From: David Geesaman
Subject: Re: Practice mats
|
Otto wrote:
> In addition, I realize that many of the adult golfers simply fell into the
> game(did not play junior golf)and never had the opportunity to be properly
> trained.
>
> Perhaps it is a sign of our society in general?
Well the sign of our society is that few adults ever consider if they
need to learn something.
Dave
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Date: 04 Mar 2007 11:23:01
From: A Brick In The Wall
Subject: Re: Practice mats
|
"Felice" <delcolle@socal.rr.com > wrote in message
news:45eae500$0$28126$4c368faf@roadrunner.com...
>I have read numerous times that one should avoid using "mats" for their
> practice sessions, however, the course near to me does not have any other
> option.
>
> My frustration results from being able to strike the ball quite well
> during
> practice, but when I play a round of golf, I look like I have never picked
> up a club before.
>
> I am trying to determine if this is a result of a mental breakdown or is
> it
> just that much easier to hit off of those mats?
>
> Any thoughts or comments?
>
> Thanks in advance.
>
>
Is everyone required to use the mats?
At the range closest to my home they have mats --- but the owner allows us
to move out into the grass if we wish.
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Date: 04 Mar 2007 22:15:31
From: Howard Brazee
Subject: Re: Practice mats
|
On Sun, 4 2007 11:23:01 -0500, "A Brick In The Wall"
<NoSpam@NoThanks.net > wrote:
>Is everyone required to use the mats?
I used to use a range that had mats in the winter, grass the rest of
the year. I switched to one that has grass all year long.
>At the range closest to my home they have mats --- but the owner allows us
>to move out into the grass if we wish.
I've never come across this.
I played at a resort one time that had a teeing area that was half way
between grass and Astroturf.
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Date: 04 Mar 2007 22:12:28
From: A Brick in the Wall
Subject: Re: Practice mats
|
"Howard Brazee" <howard@brazee.net > wrote in message
news:u4hmu253c8tq5up491uctrb3rq3skg5v4u@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 4 2007 11:23:01 -0500, "A Brick In The Wall"
> <NoSpam@NoThanks.net> wrote:
>
>>Is everyone required to use the mats?
>
> I used to use a range that had mats in the winter, grass the rest of
> the year. I switched to one that has grass all year long.
>
>>At the range closest to my home they have mats --- but the owner allows us
>>to move out into the grass if we wish.
>
> I've never come across this.
>
Hey -- I just asked the owner --- but I've found others doing it also ---
the "serious" players go for the grass & the guys just pounding driver are
happy on the mats with the rubber tees.
> I played at a resort one time that had a teeing area that was half way
> between grass and Astroturf.
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Date: 04 Mar 2007 07:45:20
From: Ken Meltzer
Subject: Re: Practice mats
|
On 4, 10:25 am, "Felice" <delco...@socal.rr.com > wrote:
> I have read numerous times that one should avoid using "mats" for their
> practice sessions, however, the course near to me does not have any other
> option.
>
> My frustration results from being able to strike the ball quite well during
> practice, but when I play a round of golf, I look like I have never picked
> up a club before.
>
> I am trying to determine if this is a result of a mental breakdown or is it
> just that much easier to hit off of those mats?
>
> Any thoughts or comments?
>
> Thanks in advance.
The problem with mats is that it's quite possible to have the club hit
the ground behind the ball and still get a good shot result, thanks to
a rebound effect. Not only that, but if you hit with a true
descending blow on the hard surface, you run the risk of injury. So,
mats do nothing to promote the kind of descending blow you want on
irons.
My ball-striking improved the most only when I was finally able to
practice regularly on grass. Now, when I go to a range that only has
mats, I pretty much limit myself to hitting a driver.
Still, you may have no other practice option that a range with mats.
Sometimes, those mats have a separate strip that is a little softer
and more "grass-like." I'd try to search these out as much as
possible.
Best,
Ken
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Date: 04 Mar 2007 08:33:19
From: Felice
Subject: Re: Practice mats
|
Ken,
Thanks very much for your comments and advice. At least I know the
implications now.
"Ken Meltzer" <commspkmn@aol.com > wrote in message
news:1173023120.788115.96790@64g2000cwx.googlegroups.com...
> On 4, 10:25 am, "Felice" <delco...@socal.rr.com> wrote:
> > I have read numerous times that one should avoid using "mats" for their
> > practice sessions, however, the course near to me does not have any
other
> > option.
> >
> > My frustration results from being able to strike the ball quite well
during
> > practice, but when I play a round of golf, I look like I have never
picked
> > up a club before.
> >
> > I am trying to determine if this is a result of a mental breakdown or is
it
> > just that much easier to hit off of those mats?
> >
> > Any thoughts or comments?
> >
> > Thanks in advance.
>
> The problem with mats is that it's quite possible to have the club hit
> the ground behind the ball and still get a good shot result, thanks to
> a rebound effect. Not only that, but if you hit with a true
> descending blow on the hard surface, you run the risk of injury. So,
> mats do nothing to promote the kind of descending blow you want on
> irons.
> My ball-striking improved the most only when I was finally able to
> practice regularly on grass. Now, when I go to a range that only has
> mats, I pretty much limit myself to hitting a driver.
> Still, you may have no other practice option that a range with mats.
> Sometimes, those mats have a separate strip that is a little softer
> and more "grass-like." I'd try to search these out as much as
> possible.
> Best,
> Ken
>
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