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Main
Date: 04 Sep 2006 20:29:00
From: warren montgomery
Subject: It's the putter -- once again.
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It's not hard to see why Tiger can blow folks away even when they are
playing well. How often do you see a guy line up 30 footers and hit them
like he truely expects to make every one? As someone who can't consistently
sink 3 footers, that's the most amazing thing to me about Tiger, and what
clearly separates his "okay" days from his exceptional days. All those guys
seem to be able to knock it 300 yards and hack it out of any kind of junk to
the green, but when Tiger is on, he's going to sink at least half the putts
he has on the greens. When he's off, he missses some 3 footers and the
field has a chance.
--
Warren Montgomery (wamontgomery@att.net)
http://home.att.net/~wamontgomery
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Date: 06 Sep 2006 17:17:14
From:
Subject: Re: It's the putter -- once again.
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well, here we go again on, missing / making putts.
as stated before, the first putt from the green should be for distance,
if you hole out, it's a bonus, if you don't, it should be a tap-in. in,
in two or less, not bad.
what is there about that, that you don't understand?
granted, some so-called putters would do better playing croquet.:--)
>m h o
>=A0v =83e
>>=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0e s p r i t =A0d e =A0c o r p
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Date: 05 Sep 2006 12:49:50
From: cja
Subject: Re: It's the putter -- once again.
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long&left wrote:
> ya don't need a book, ya need to play more golf. IMO anyone who tried to
> put green reading in a book is an ex car salesman. It'd be like trying
> to explain "touch" or "feel" in print...
>
I will admit that the more I play, the better I get. Local knowledge
helps, but what to do when I see a course for the first time? I'm
looking for more ideas like what Annika has in her book. One tip she
gave is to take a look from about half way between the ball and the
hole, on the low side, a few yards away from the line. It's a good way
to get an idea of how much the putt will break.
I agree you can only develop touch by practicing, but I think reading
greens is different. Practice helps, but there are things to do to help
you see the line. Pelz convinced me not to believe in the plumb bob,
and I don't want to be a spiderman like Villegas. Other than that, I'm
open to suggestions.
- cja
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Date: 06 Sep 2006 22:07:32
From: Howard Brazee
Subject: Re: It's the putter -- once again.
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On 5 Sep 2006 12:49:50 -0700, "cja" <cja@excite.com > wrote:
> Pelz convinced me not to believe in the plumb bob,
>and I don't want to be a spiderman like Villegas.
It works.
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Date: 06 Sep 2006 22:05:59
From: Howard Brazee
Subject: Re: It's the putter -- once again.
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On 5 Sep 2006 12:49:50 -0700, "cja" <cja@excite.com > wrote:
>I will admit that the more I play, the better I get. Local knowledge
>helps, but what to do when I see a course for the first time?
The more different greens you play, the better you get at reading. Of
course, you need to work at reading at each course.
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Date: 05 Sep 2006 14:49:36
From: long&left
Subject: Re: It's the putter -- once again.
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cja wrote:
> long&left wrote:
>
>> ya don't need a book, ya need to play more golf. IMO anyone who tried to
>> put green reading in a book is an ex car salesman. It'd be like trying
>> to explain "touch" or "feel" in print...
>>
> I will admit that the more I play, the better I get. Local knowledge
> helps, but what to do when I see a course for the first time? I'm
> looking for more ideas like what Annika has in her book. One tip she
> gave is to take a look from about half way between the ball and the
> hole, on the low side, a few yards away from the line. It's a good way
> to get an idea of how much the putt will break.
>
> I agree you can only develop touch by practicing, but I think reading
> greens is different. Practice helps, but there are things to do to help
> you see the line. Pelz convinced me not to believe in the plumb bob,
> and I don't want to be a spiderman like Villegas. Other than that, I'm
> open to suggestions.
>
> - cja
>
I wish I could explain to you how to read greens cause I'm pretty good
at it (guess who'll now have 40 putts tomorrow :) I never read Annika's
book but I also most always look at a breaking putt from the low side. I
also don't believe in plumb bobbing but do it anyway cause it looks cool
:) I have heard of people who actually see the line the balls going to
travel on. I've tried to see it but haven't had much luck with the
animation input into the brain yet. I just look see, see where the high
point of the line will be, pick out a spot somewhere a couple of feet in
front of the ball that will get the ball to that point, and roll the
ball over the spot.
Another bit of input: line is overrated, speed is most important on the
putting green. That and being able to consistently hit your spot 2 or 3
feet in front of you...good luck!
Dave
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Date: 05 Sep 2006 12:09:16
From: cja
Subject: Re: It's the putter -- once again.
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warren montgomery wrote:
> Anyone remember the US Women's open a few years back
> when someone we never heard of before or after and couldn't hit the ball
> very far won -- she sunk every putt.
>
Hilary Lunke? The lady with a bag full of fairway woods, one of the
shortest hitters out there (driving average 237.2 this season); but
you're right, she putted great that week in '03 at Pumpkin Ridge.
> My real point was that what's different about Tiger is that others have
> good putting days from time to time. Tiger has very few days that aren't
> exceptional.
>
One of the things about Tiger's putting that has impressed me a lot
lately is how often he hits putts with the perfect speed. He's great
at reading greens, getting occasional help with that from Stevie, is
able to hit the putt where he wants to, and gets the speed right. What
else is there? The putts go in.
In my game I usually can only rely on one of those factors: hitting it
where I want to. My green reading ability is inconsistent, my speed is
ok most of the time, but can be way off too. In Annika's book, and in
one of the Pelz books, I've found a few tips on green reading, but I've
yet to find a really good resource that can help me improve my ability
to read greens. Does anyone know of a good book for that?
- cja
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Date: 05 Sep 2006 12:27:09
From: long&left
Subject: Re: It's the putter -- once again.
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cja wrote:
> warren montgomery wrote:
>
>> Anyone remember the US Women's open a few years back
>> when someone we never heard of before or after and couldn't hit the ball
>> very far won -- she sunk every putt.
>>
> Hilary Lunke? The lady with a bag full of fairway woods, one of the
> shortest hitters out there (driving average 237.2 this season); but
> you're right, she putted great that week in '03 at Pumpkin Ridge.
>
>> My real point was that what's different about Tiger is that others have
>> good putting days from time to time. Tiger has very few days that aren't
>> exceptional.
>>
> One of the things about Tiger's putting that has impressed me a lot
> lately is how often he hits putts with the perfect speed. He's great
> at reading greens, getting occasional help with that from Stevie, is
> able to hit the putt where he wants to, and gets the speed right. What
> else is there? The putts go in.
>
> In my game I usually can only rely on one of those factors: hitting it
> where I want to. My green reading ability is inconsistent, my speed is
> ok most of the time, but can be way off too. In Annika's book, and in
> one of the Pelz books, I've found a few tips on green reading, but I've
> yet to find a really good resource that can help me improve my ability
> to read greens. Does anyone know of a good book for that?
>
> - cja
>
ya don't need a book, ya need to play more golf. IMO anyone who tried to
put green reading in a book is an ex car salesman. It'd be like trying
to explain "touch" or "feel" in print...
Dave
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Date: 05 Sep 2006 10:34:54
From:
Subject: Re: It's the putter -- once again.
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David wrote:
> Well, not from 3 feet. My typical routine on the putting green is
> to practice for at least 1 hour and usually in the 6-8 foot range. I
> also don't like to pick straight putts. A breaking putt is better to
> practice because it really forces you to hit your k. Missing your
> k, especially low, means that the putt is not going in. On
> straight putts, you can miss the k a little bit and the ball can
> still find its way to the bottom of the cup.
I do four rounds on a hole. 6 feet from the hole, put a ball k
down. Putt from next to it until I make 5 in a row. Then,
move 90 degrees around the hole and repeat. Some days this is
5 minutes, some days it is 45 minutes. I've tried all different
distances and decided to work from a distance where I can
make 75-80% of the putts.
This type of practice definitely improves your putting (but then
again, so do lots of other types of practice).
-PA
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Date: 05 Sep 2006 04:10:04
From: Larry Bud
Subject: Re: It's the putter -- once again.
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warren montgomery wrote:
> It's not hard to see why Tiger can blow folks away even when they are
> playing well. How often do you see a guy line up 30 footers and hit them
> like he truely expects to make every one? As someone who can't consistently
> sink 3 footers, that's the most amazing thing to me about Tiger, and what
> clearly separates his "okay" days from his exceptional days. All those guys
> seem to be able to knock it 300 yards and hack it out of any kind of junk to
> the green, but when Tiger is on, he's going to sink at least half the putts
> he has on the greens. When he's off, he missses some 3 footers and the
> field has a chance.
What you have to remember is that WHOEVER the leaders are, they are all
knocking in the putts, which is why they are the leaders in the first
place.
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Date: 05 Sep 2006 09:05:37
From: warren montgomery
Subject: Re: It's the putter -- once again.
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>
> What you have to remember is that WHOEVER the leaders are, they are all
> knocking in the putts, which is why they are the leaders in the first
> place.
>
Yes of course that's true. What's different about Tiger from what I've seen
is he really seems to expect to putt like that, and very often delivers on
those expectations. Anyone remember the US Women's open a few years back
when someone we never heard of before or after and couldn't hit the ball
very far won -- she sunk every putt. I speculated at the time that
exceptional putting and chipping were far more effective in winning than
long drives or good iron shots. The difference between Vijay's Sunday and
Monday rounds was largely putting. My real point was that what's different
about Tiger is that others have good putting days from time to time. Tiger
has very few days that aren't exceptional.
Warren Montgomery (wamontgomery@att.net)
http://home.att.net/~wamontgomery
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Date: 04 Sep 2006 21:59:24
From: pete z
Subject: Re: It's the putter -- once again.
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Howard Brazee wrote:
> On Mon, 4 Sep 2006 20:29:00 -0500, "warren montgomery"
> <wamontgomery@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
>
> >It's not hard to see why Tiger can blow folks away even when they are
> >playing well. How often do you see a guy line up 30 footers and hit them
> >like he truely expects to make every one?
>
> It's not uncommon with winners. Interviews with winners more often
> than not have them saying "I putted well". Winners with also-rans
> usually have them saying "my putts didn't drop".
I can distinctly remember Tiger saying that several times when he
didn't win.
Something like, I hit the ball well, but didn't putt well.
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Date: 05 Sep 2006 00:25:24
From: Zuke
Subject: Re: It's the putter -- once again.
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On Tue, 5 Sep 2006, Howard Brazee wrote:
> On Mon, 4 Sep 2006 21:34:16 -0400, "rcoy27" <rcoy27@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> I just heard on TV the other day that Tiger had not missed any put inside 4
>> feet in 2006. Maybe I heard incorrectly like I usually hear what my wife
>> says.
>
> Thanks. I posted that a couple of weeks ago, but was unable to find
> where I got that information. Still hearsay, but with a bigger vote.
>
I saw him miss a three footer a few days ago or maybe it was the
first hole of the PGA. He doesn't miss many that's for sure.
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Date: 05 Sep 2006 02:13:40
From: Howard Brazee
Subject: Re: It's the putter -- once again.
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On Mon, 4 Sep 2006 20:29:00 -0500, "warren montgomery"
<wamontgomery@worldnet.att.net > wrote:
>It's not hard to see why Tiger can blow folks away even when they are
>playing well. How often do you see a guy line up 30 footers and hit them
>like he truely expects to make every one?
It's not uncommon with winners. Interviews with winners more often
than not have them saying "I putted well". Winners with also-rans
usually have them saying "my putts didn't drop".
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Date: 04 Sep 2006 19:08:33
From:
Subject: Re: It's the putter -- once again.
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Bobby Knight wrote:
field has a chance.
>
> I heard a radio golf program Sunday, and the host passed this on
> from a conversation with Hank Haney. He said that oneof TW's daily
> practices is to find a straight 3 foot putt and play it 100 to 150
> times. Haney said that he kept a general count this year and up to
> the British Open TW had tried that putt over 5000 times, and missed
> 6.
How many here think they could put up with the boredom of that exercise
every day?
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Date: 06 Sep 2006 22:04:24
From: Howard Brazee
Subject: Re: It's the putter -- once again.
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On 4 Sep 2006 19:08:33 -0700, bungalow_steve@yahoo.com wrote:
>How many here think they could put up with the boredom of that exercise
>every day?
The hard part here would be picking up the balls. With the money to
hire a kid to do that work, I'd do that for a while.
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Date: 05 Sep 2006 16:08:16
From: David
Subject: Re: It's the putter -- once again.
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On 4 Sep 2006 19:08:33 -0700, bungalow_steve@yahoo.com wrote:
>
>Bobby Knight wrote:
>field has a chance.
>>
>> I heard a radio golf program Sunday, and the host passed this on
>> from a conversation with Hank Haney. He said that oneof TW's daily
>> practices is to find a straight 3 foot putt and play it 100 to 150
>> times. Haney said that he kept a general count this year and up to
>> the British Open TW had tried that putt over 5000 times, and missed
>> 6.
>
>How many here think they could put up with the boredom of that exercise
>every day?
Well, not from 3 feet. My typical routine on the putting green is
to practice for at least 1 hour and usually in the 6-8 foot range. I
also don't like to pick straight putts. A breaking putt is better to
practice because it really forces you to hit your k. Missing your
k, especially low, means that the putt is not going in. On
straight putts, you can miss the k a little bit and the ball can
still find its way to the bottom of the cup.
David
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Date: 05 Sep 2006 06:20:57
From: Dave Clary
Subject: Re: It's the putter -- once again.
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On 4 Sep 2006 19:08:33 -0700, bungalow_steve@yahoo.com wrote:
>
>Bobby Knight wrote:
>field has a chance.
>>
>> I heard a radio golf program Sunday, and the host passed this on
>> from a conversation with Hank Haney. He said that oneof TW's daily
>> practices is to find a straight 3 foot putt and play it 100 to 150
>> times. Haney said that he kept a general count this year and up to
>> the British Open TW had tried that putt over 5000 times, and missed
>> 6.
>
>How many here think they could put up with the boredom of that exercise
>every day?
Outside of the mental aspect, my back couldn't put up with that
exercise!
Dave Clary/Corpus Christi, Tx
Home: http://davidclary.com
Kinky for Texas Gov
"Why The Hell Not"
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Date: 05 Sep 2006 03:56:09
From: jeffc
Subject: Re: It's the putter -- once again.
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<bungalow_steve@yahoo.com > wrote in message
news:1157422113.172758.297190@74g2000cwt.googlegroups.com...
>
> Bobby Knight wrote:
> field has a chance.
>>
>> I heard a radio golf program Sunday, and the host passed this on
>> from a conversation with Hank Haney. He said that oneof TW's daily
>> practices is to find a straight 3 foot putt and play it 100 to 150
>> times. Haney said that he kept a general count this year and up to
>> the British Open TW had tried that putt over 5000 times, and missed
>> 6.
>
> How many here think they could put up with the boredom of that exercise
> every day?
Meaning what, Tiger has super human discipline? Hardly. That would take
all of about 10 minutes. I'd gladly trade 10 minutes of what I do during
the day for that. And for $10 million, I'd do a lot more than that.
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Date: 04 Sep 2006 20:42:12
From: Bobby Knight
Subject: Re: It's the putter -- once again.
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On Mon, 4 Sep 2006 20:29:00 -0500, "warren montgomery"
<wamontgomery@worldnet.att.net > wrote:
>It's not hard to see why Tiger can blow folks away even when they are
>playing well. How often do you see a guy line up 30 footers and hit them
>like he truely expects to make every one? As someone who can't consistently
>sink 3 footers, that's the most amazing thing to me about Tiger, and what
>clearly separates his "okay" days from his exceptional days. All those guys
>seem to be able to knock it 300 yards and hack it out of any kind of junk to
>the green, but when Tiger is on, he's going to sink at least half the putts
>he has on the greens. When he's off, he missses some 3 footers and the
>field has a chance.
I heard a radio golf program Sunday, and the host passed this on
from a conversation with Hank Haney. He said that oneof TW's daily
practices is to find a straight 3 foot putt and play it 100 to 150
times. Haney said that he kept a general count this year and up to
the British Open TW had tried that putt over 5000 times, and missed
6. That's why he doesn't mind going for any putt...he's gonna make
the 3-4 footers coming back....IF he misses it\.
___,
\o
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Date: 04 Sep 2006 22:58:16
From: Mike Dalecki
Subject: Re: It's the putter -- once again.
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Bobby Knight wrote:
> On Mon, 4 Sep 2006 20:29:00 -0500, "warren montgomery"
> <wamontgomery@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
>
>
>>It's not hard to see why Tiger can blow folks away even when they are
>>playing well. How often do you see a guy line up 30 footers and hit them
>>like he truely expects to make every one? As someone who can't consistently
>>sink 3 footers, that's the most amazing thing to me about Tiger, and what
>>clearly separates his "okay" days from his exceptional days. All those guys
>>seem to be able to knock it 300 yards and hack it out of any kind of junk to
>>the green, but when Tiger is on, he's going to sink at least half the putts
>>he has on the greens. When he's off, he missses some 3 footers and the
>>field has a chance.
>
>
> I heard a radio golf program Sunday, and the host passed this on
> from a conversation with Hank Haney. He said that oneof TW's daily
> practices is to find a straight 3 foot putt and play it 100 to 150
> times. Haney said that he kept a general count this year and up to
> the British Open TW had tried that putt over 5000 times, and missed
> 6. That's why he doesn't mind going for any putt...he's gonna make
> the 3-4 footers coming back....IF he misses it\.
Gary Player used to do that, with something like 2-footers if I remember
right.
Amazing how that seems to translate into major championship wins.
Mike
--
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mike Dalecki GCA Accredited Clubmaker http://clubdoctor.com
RSG-Wisconsin 2006: June 23-25 Info: http://dalecki.net/rsgwis2006/
RSG-Wisconsin 2006 Pics: http://dalecki.net/rsgwis2006/pics/
------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Date: 04 Sep 2006 19:03:34
From: long&left
Subject: Re: It's the putter -- once again.
|
Bobby Knight wrote:
> On Mon, 4 Sep 2006 20:29:00 -0500, "warren montgomery"
> <wamontgomery@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
>=20
>> It's not hard to see why Tiger can blow folks away even when they are =
>> playing well. How often do you see a guy line up 30 footers and hit t=
hem=20
>> like he truely expects to make every one? As someone who can't consis=
tently=20
>> sink 3 footers, that's the most amazing thing to me about Tiger, and w=
hat=20
>> clearly separates his "okay" days from his exceptional days. All thos=
e guys=20
>> seem to be able to knock it 300 yards and hack it out of any kind of j=
unk to=20
>> the green, but when Tiger is on, he's going to sink at least half the =
putts=20
>> he has on the greens. When he's off, he missses some 3 footers and th=
e=20
>> field has a chance.
>=20
> I heard a radio golf program Sunday, and the host passed this on
> from a conversation with Hank Haney. He said that oneof TW's daily
> practices is to find a straight 3 foot putt and play it 100 to 150
> times. Haney said that he kept a general count this year and up to
> the British Open TW had tried that putt over 5000 times, and missed
> 6. That's why he doesn't mind going for any putt...he's gonna make
> the 3-4 footers coming back....IF he misses it\.
> ___, =20
> \o =20
>
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Date: 06 Sep 2006 17:25:37
From:
Subject: Re: It's the putter -- once again.
|
>that would be a lot of putts to have to
watch...
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
hear!!
>m h o
>=A0v =83e
>>=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0e s p r i t =A0d e =A0c o r p
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Date: 04 Sep 2006 21:11:24
From: Bobby Knight
Subject: Re: It's the putter -- once again.
|
On Mon, 04 Sep 2006 19:03:34 -0700, long&left <nospam@diespammers.com >
wrote:
>Bobby Knight wrote:
>> Haney said that he kept a general count this year and up to
>> the British Open TW had tried that putt over 5000 times, and missed
>> 6. That's why he doesn't mind going for any putt...he's gonna make
>> the 3-4 footers coming back....IF he misses it\.
>> “Someone likes every shot”
>> bk
>
>that would be a lot of putts to have to watch...
Don't shoot the messenger...I'm just reporting what was supposedly
said. However, I saw Tiger practicing this before a tournament on
TV a couple of weeks ago. He had a dozen or so balls, and there
was a kid sitting beside the hole, taking each putted ball out
and rolling it back to the pile. How would you like that
job???
___,
\o
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| | | | |
Date: 05 Sep 2006 07:26:40
From: long&left
Subject: Re: It's the putter -- once again.
|
Bobby Knight wrote:
> On Mon, 04 Sep 2006 19:03:34 -0700, long&left <nospam@diespammers.com>
> wrote:
>=20
>> Bobby Knight wrote:
>>> Haney said that he kept a general count this year and up to
>>> the British Open TW had tried that putt over 5000 times, and missed=
>>> 6. That's why he doesn't mind going for any putt...he's gonna make
>>> the 3-4 footers coming back....IF he misses it\.
> =20
>>> =93Someone likes every shot=94
>>> bk
>> that would be a lot of putts to have to watch...
>=20
> Don't shoot the messenger...I'm just reporting what was supposedly
> said. However, I saw Tiger practicing this before a tournament on
> TV a couple of weeks ago. He had a dozen or so balls, and there
> was a kid sitting beside the hole, taking each putted ball out
> and rolling it back to the pile. How would you like that
> job???
> ___, =20
> \o =20
>
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Date: 04 Sep 2006 21:34:16
From: rcoy27
Subject: Re: It's the putter -- once again.
|
I just heard on TV the other day that Tiger had not missed any put inside 4
feet in 2006. Maybe I heard incorrectly like I usually hear what my wife
says.
"warren montgomery" <wamontgomery@worldnet.att.net > wrote in message
news:xrCdnZC1m7FBT2HZnZ2dnUVZ_rednZ2d@comcast.com...
> It's not hard to see why Tiger can blow folks away even when they are
> playing well. How often do you see a guy line up 30 footers and hit them
> like he truely expects to make every one? As someone who can't
> consistently sink 3 footers, that's the most amazing thing to me about
> Tiger, and what clearly separates his "okay" days from his exceptional
> days. All those guys seem to be able to knock it 300 yards and hack it
> out of any kind of junk to the green, but when Tiger is on, he's going to
> sink at least half the putts he has on the greens. When he's off, he
> missses some 3 footers and the field has a chance.
>
> --
> Warren Montgomery (wamontgomery@att.net)
> http://home.att.net/~wamontgomery
>
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Date: 05 Sep 2006 02:15:22
From: Howard Brazee
Subject: Re: It's the putter -- once again.
|
On Mon, 4 Sep 2006 21:34:16 -0400, "rcoy27" <rcoy27@yahoo.com > wrote:
> I just heard on TV the other day that Tiger had not missed any put inside 4
>feet in 2006. Maybe I heard incorrectly like I usually hear what my wife
>says.
Thanks. I posted that a couple of weeks ago, but was unable to find
where I got that information. Still hearsay, but with a bigger vote.
|
|
