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Date: 08 Apr 2007 13:14:31
From: tseverson
Subject: Choices for a set of game improvement irons
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I have a 16 handicap and am in the market for a new set of game
improvement irons. I have heard good things about the Mizuno mx-25,
the Callaway x-20 and the TaylorMade r7 cgb max sets of irons.
I would welcome comments about these different set of irons especially
if you have directly compared one set against another. Also, as I
approach the age of 60, would graphite shafts offer any advantages for
me?
Thanks for your comments and suggestions.
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Date: 11 Apr 2007 11:54:28
From: The_Professor
Subject: Re: Choices for a set of game improvement irons
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On Apr 11, 11:32 am, "tseverson" <tsever...@mn.rr.com > wrote:
> On Apr 10, 2:08 pm, "The_Professor" <d...@att.net> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Apr 8, 3:14 pm, "tseverson" <tsever...@mn.rr.com> wrote:
>
> > Graphite shafts will help you with swingspeed issues. However, the
> > lower priced mid kick kinds of graphite shafts are not particularly
> > good shafts, at least in my experience. You need to go to the heavier,
> > higher kickpoint graphite shafts to get any decent quality. They run
> > at least 20 bucks per shaft. I have found ultralight steel shafts to
> > be a great compromise. They are a tad expensive for steel shafts, in
> > the 12 to 15 dollar range per shaft. You can get good mid kick
> > dynalites or high kick dynamic golds in the super light steel shafts.
> > I need the lower ballflight of the high kick shafts so I went with the
> > DGs. Really changed my game for the better from a GIR perspective.
>
> > IMHO, the clubhead doesn't make that much difference. I am your speed
> > as a golfer. Of the 3 you mentioned, I get the best results from the
> > Callaways. I have component heads that are normal sized cavity backs
> > (oversize defeats the value of the cavity back, IMHO, unless you get
> > into the Callaway shovel designs) with very low offset and very low
> > price. I spent the money on the shafts! IMHO again, the best OEM clubs
> > for a hacker like me are Wilson Deep Red Fat Shafts. That fat shaft
> > idea was one of the best things anyone came up with in irons. If I
> > could get them as components, I would have them in the bag!
>
> > Nice thing about better OEMs is you will get matched taper tip shafts
> > though, which is a nice touch.
>
> I have been playing with OEM Wilson Deep Red Fat Shafts for 5 or 6
> years. I do like the feel of the Wilson clubs but I am looking to take
> advantage of club improvements in the past few years.
>
> A previous post on this message board some months ago stated the
> TaylorMade r7 cgb ultra-light steel shafts provide an increased swing
> speed other benefits attributed to graphite shafts. This is similar to
> what you expressed in your post. Has anyone playing the TM r7 cgb
> found this to be true?
>
> Also, your comments about the shaft being more important than the club
> head is a common comment found in many posts to rec.sport.golf.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
You may want to hang on to the Deep Reds. Everyone I have ever known
who has them goes back to them time and again. They are so much more
stable than other clubs. You may well find that with any other club
you spray the ball around a lot more than with the Deep Reds. You may
hit it farther...but farther into where?!!
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Date: 11 Apr 2007 09:32:30
From: tseverson
Subject: Re: Choices for a set of game improvement irons
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On Apr 10, 2:08 pm, "The_Professor" <d...@att.net > wrote:
> On Apr 8, 3:14 pm, "tseverson" <tsever...@mn.rr.com> wrote:
>
> Graphite shafts will help you with swingspeed issues. However, the
> lower priced mid kick kinds of graphite shafts are not particularly
> good shafts, at least in my experience. You need to go to the heavier,
> higher kickpoint graphite shafts to get any decent quality. They run
> at least 20 bucks per shaft. I have found ultralight steel shafts to
> be a great compromise. They are a tad expensive for steel shafts, in
> the 12 to 15 dollar range per shaft. You can get good mid kick
> dynalites or high kick dynamic golds in the super light steel shafts.
> I need the lower ballflight of the high kick shafts so I went with the
> DGs. Really changed my game for the better from a GIR perspective.
>
> IMHO, the clubhead doesn't make that much difference. I am your speed
> as a golfer. Of the 3 you mentioned, I get the best results from the
> Callaways. I have component heads that are normal sized cavity backs
> (oversize defeats the value of the cavity back, IMHO, unless you get
> into the Callaway shovel designs) with very low offset and very low
> price. I spent the money on the shafts! IMHO again, the best OEM clubs
> for a hacker like me are Wilson Deep Red Fat Shafts. That fat shaft
> idea was one of the best things anyone came up with in irons. If I
> could get them as components, I would have them in the bag!
>
> Nice thing about better OEMs is you will get matched taper tip shafts
> though, which is a nice touch.
I have been playing with OEM Wilson Deep Red Fat Shafts for 5 or 6
years. I do like the feel of the Wilson clubs but I am looking to take
advantage of club improvements in the past few years.
A previous post on this message board some months ago stated the
TaylorMade r7 cgb ultra-light steel shafts provide an increased swing
speed other benefits attributed to graphite shafts. This is similar to
what you expressed in your post. Has anyone playing the TM r7 cgb
found this to be true?
Also, your comments about the shaft being more important than the club
head is a common comment found in many posts to rec.sport.golf.
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Date: 11 Apr 2007 18:08:22
From: David Geesaman
Subject: Re: Choices for a set of game improvement irons
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tseverson wrote:
> On Apr 10, 2:08 pm, "The_Professor" <d...@att.net> wrote:
>> On Apr 8, 3:14 pm, "tseverson" <tsever...@mn.rr.com> wrote:
>>
>> Graphite shafts will help you with swingspeed issues. However, the
>> lower priced mid kick kinds of graphite shafts are not particularly
>> good shafts, at least in my experience. You need to go to the heavier,
>> higher kickpoint graphite shafts to get any decent quality. They run
>> at least 20 bucks per shaft. I have found ultralight steel shafts to
>> be a great compromise. They are a tad expensive for steel shafts, in
>> the 12 to 15 dollar range per shaft. You can get good mid kick
>> dynalites or high kick dynamic golds in the super light steel shafts.
>> I need the lower ballflight of the high kick shafts so I went with the
>> DGs. Really changed my game for the better from a GIR perspective.
>>
>> IMHO, the clubhead doesn't make that much difference. I am your speed
>> as a golfer. Of the 3 you mentioned, I get the best results from the
>> Callaways. I have component heads that are normal sized cavity backs
>> (oversize defeats the value of the cavity back, IMHO, unless you get
>> into the Callaway shovel designs) with very low offset and very low
>> price. I spent the money on the shafts! IMHO again, the best OEM clubs
>> for a hacker like me are Wilson Deep Red Fat Shafts. That fat shaft
>> idea was one of the best things anyone came up with in irons. If I
>> could get them as components, I would have them in the bag!
>>
>> Nice thing about better OEMs is you will get matched taper tip shafts
>> though, which is a nice touch.
>
> I have been playing with OEM Wilson Deep Red Fat Shafts for 5 or 6
> years. I do like the feel of the Wilson clubs but I am looking to take
> advantage of club improvements in the past few years.
You won't. The state of the art hasn't improved appreciably. The lofts
might be a bit stronger, so if you need a couple vanity yards, but any
golfer worth impressing knows the difference.
> A previous post on this message board some months ago stated the
> TaylorMade r7 cgb ultra-light steel shafts provide an increased swing
> speed other benefits attributed to graphite shafts.
The lighter weight shafts change swingweight, and *some* golfers swing
that lighter shafted club with a little more swing speed. You at best
you may see a little increase in ball velocity at impact, but nothing
different than the traditional steel vs. graphite argument ever was.
These lighter steel shafts simply fill the gap between them a little bit
closer.
I strongly recommend you demo any major change like that until you're
absolutely confident in the change. Deep reds are big hockey stick
clubs, and have a substantially different feel than most clubs.
> Also, your comments about the shaft being more important than the club
> head is a common comment found in many posts to rec.sport.golf.
I agree with this notion, but again a quality shaft is a quality shaft.
There is definitely diminishing returns - those fancy Diamana shafts
probably won't gain you one yard over a cheaper Proforce shaft, but both
of those quality brands can be much better than the OEM graphite that
comes as standard on new (or old) clubs.
Dave
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Date: 10 Apr 2007 15:43:19
From: annika1980
Subject: Re: Choices for a set of game improvement irons
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On Apr 8, 4:14 pm, "tseverson" <tsever...@mn.rr.com > wrote:
> I have a 16 handicap and am in the market for a new set of game
> improvement irons. I have heard good things about the Mizuno mx-25,
> the Callaway x-20 and the TaylorMade r7 cgb max sets of irons.
>
You want true game improvement? Get an old set of Hogan Apex PC
irons. Learn to hit those babies and your game will really improve.
I've always thought that the irons we usually call "game improvement"
irons should really be called "temporary score improvement" irons.
When you first use them your score will usually improve since they are
so forgiving. After a time, however, your swing actually becomes
worse than it was, and your scores go back up. Then you start looking
for even newer, better irons. And the vicious cycle continues....
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Date: 10 Apr 2007 14:08:31
From: The_Professor
Subject: Re: Choices for a set of game improvement irons
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On Apr 8, 3:14 pm, "tseverson" <tsever...@mn.rr.com > wrote:
> I have a 16 handicap and am in the market for a new set of game
> improvement irons. I have heard good things about the Mizuno mx-25,
> the Callaway x-20 and the TaylorMade r7 cgb max sets of irons.
>
> I would welcome comments about these different set of irons especially
> if you have directly compared one set against another. Also, as I
> approach the age of 60, would graphite shafts offer any advantages for
> me?
>
> Thanks for your comments and suggestions.
Graphite shafts will help you with swingspeed issues. However, the
lower priced mid kick kinds of graphite shafts are not particularly
good shafts, at least in my experience. You need to go to the heavier,
higher kickpoint graphite shafts to get any decent quality. They run
at least 20 bucks per shaft. I have found ultralight steel shafts to
be a great compromise. They are a tad expensive for steel shafts, in
the 12 to 15 dollar range per shaft. You can get good mid kick
dynalites or high kick dynamic golds in the super light steel shafts.
I need the lower ballflight of the high kick shafts so I went with the
DGs. Really changed my game for the better from a GIR perspective.
IMHO, the clubhead doesn't make that much difference. I am your speed
as a golfer. Of the 3 you mentioned, I get the best results from the
Callaways. I have component heads that are normal sized cavity backs
(oversize defeats the value of the cavity back, IMHO, unless you get
into the Callaway shovel designs) with very low offset and very low
price. I spent the money on the shafts! IMHO again, the best OEM clubs
for a hacker like me are Wilson Deep Red Fat Shafts. That fat shaft
idea was one of the best things anyone came up with in irons. If I
could get them as components, I would have them in the bag!
Nice thing about better OEMs is you will get matched taper tip shafts
though, which is a nice touch.
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Date: 10 Apr 2007 06:00:25
From: John B.
Subject: Re: Choices for a set of game improvement irons
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On Apr 8, 4:14 pm, "tseverson" <tsever...@mn.rr.com > wrote:
> I have a 16 handicap and am in the market for a new set of game
> improvement irons. I have heard good things about the Mizuno mx-25,
> the Callaway x-20 and the TaylorMade r7 cgb max sets of irons.
>
> I would welcome comments about these different set of irons especially
> if you have directly compared one set against another. Also, as I
> approach the age of 60, would graphite shafts offer any advantages for
> me?
>
> Thanks for your comments and suggestions.
I haven't looked at it yet, but the new issue of Golf Magazine is the
annual equipment issue and includes reviews of a lot of new and fancy-
schmancy clubs.
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Date: 09 Apr 2007 20:47:38
From: Jim Moore
Subject: Re: Choices for a set of game improvement irons
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I just got some new irons and they have really help. Try Cobra 9's. I had
some TM HT's
"tseverson" <tseverson@mn.rr.com > wrote in message
news:1176063271.358654.109020@y80g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
>I have a 16 handicap and am in the market for a new set of game
> improvement irons. I have heard good things about the Mizuno mx-25,
> the Callaway x-20 and the TaylorMade r7 cgb max sets of irons.
>
> I would welcome comments about these different set of irons especially
> if you have directly compared one set against another. Also, as I
> approach the age of 60, would graphite shafts offer any advantages for
> me?
>
> Thanks for your comments and suggestions.
>
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Date: 08 Apr 2007 17:13:34
From: Tom K
Subject: Re: Choices for a set of game improvement irons
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"tseverson" <tseverson@mn.rr.com > wrote in message
news:1176063271.358654.109020@y80g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
>I have a 16 handicap and am in the market for a new set of game
> improvement irons. I have heard good things about the Mizuno mx-25,
> the Callaway x-20 and the TaylorMade r7 cgb max sets of irons.
>
> I would welcome comments about these different set of irons especially
> if you have directly compared one set against another. Also, as I
> approach the age of 60, would graphite shafts offer any advantages for
> me?
>
> Thanks for your comments and suggestions.
>
Find a place that lets you hit the various clubs during an actual round. My
guy at the little golf ship her in NJ will do that.
As to graphite shafts... as we approach the age of 60... you may very well
find that they are much easier on the joints (elbow, wrists, etc.). My
golf/tennis elbow problems went away last year when the guy at the ship
replaced the steel shafts in my irons with graphite shafts.
--Tom
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