Becoming a touring pro

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Date: 05 Sep 2006 16:15:34
From: tw1990
Subject: Becoming a touring pro

Im a 16 year old with a 9 handicap and dropping (was 20 at begining of
season) and was looking at golf tours for when im older and saw there
is a spot on aplication forms for "year turned pro" and was wondering
how you go about turning pro and loosing your amature status.

Date: 07 Sep 2006 12:40:41
From: Larry Bud
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

Matt wrote:
> > tw1990 wrote:
> >> Im a 16 year old with a 9 handicap and dropping (was 20 at begining of
> >> season) and was looking at golf tours for when im older and saw there
> >> is a spot on aplication forms for "year turned pro" and was wondering
> >> how you go about turning pro and loosing your amature status.
> >
> > Get down to about a +3 or +4 index and you'll have a chance.
> >
> > 13 more shots to go!!!
>
> In one of the golf digests, they show what some of the touring pros
> handicaps would be if they entered their PGA tour rounds. Woods was a +8,
> Micheel, Sorenstam, Weir were +7's. They only did 12 or 14 of them, but
> they were all +6's to +8s.

Sure, those are the top guys. I wonder what it would take to keep your
tour card?

Date: 07 Sep 2006 22:11:38
From: Matt
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

>
> Sure, those are the top guys. I wonder what it would take to keep your
> tour card?
>

Well. 2-180th in pga tour scoring average is seperated by less than 3
strokes. I'd have to imagine it would be tough for someone thats a +4 or 5
to keep their card.

Date: 07 Sep 2006 16:26:43
From: jeffc
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

"tw1990" <tw1990_1@hotmail.com > wrote in message
news:1157498134.713657.273250@e3g2000cwe.googlegroups.com...
> Im a 16 year old with a 9 handicap and dropping (was 20 at begining of
> season) and was looking at golf tours for when im older and saw there
> is a spot on aplication forms for "year turned pro" and was wondering
> how you go about turning pro and loosing your amature status.

There is a big difference between "pro" and "touring pro". I recommend you
figure out the difference.

Date: 06 Sep 2006 17:27:08
From: pete z
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

long&left wrote:
> sjh wrote:
> > Darrell Jefress wrote:
> >> "sjh" <strat68@eudoramail.com> wrote in message
> >> news:1157575632.048859.172830@b28g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
> >>
> >>> Your detractor is arguing semantics of your original statement, but the
> >>> result is circular as Ogilvy wouldn't be over par either by that
> >>> argument.... pretzels notwithstanding.
> >> Yeah, exactly - I thought the whole notion of "anywhere, anytime, any
> >> conditions" led to some amusing possibilities, simply because it encompasses
> >> such a wide range of conditions that there's no one on earth who fits the
> >> bill, *including* the best who've ever teed up a ball.
> >>
> >> I thought I was initially being humorous, but it obviously didn't come
> >> across that way.
> >
> > Ok, benefit of doubt is in order, and perhaps for L&L- in that he could
> > have simply said "be a +2" but wanted to avoid that index thing and
> > notions of true measurements ;-)
> >
>
> I played with a +2 today. But he is a +2 at a course that he plays day
> in and day out. This guy went to Champions Tour Q school and failed,
> twice. IOW, +2 doesn't convey what I was trying to say. If I wanted to
> become a member of the PGA tour, a "touring professional" as stated by
> the OP, then I would think that I would have to be able to shoot a
> minimum of 2 under par at any course that I was going to play. No
> mention of professional events, against professional competition. You
> can't even get to that point unless you can shoot less than par
> regularly...that was my point to the OP. I have no idea how the US Open
> got in the conversation...
> Dave

Yep, most people don't realize how hard it is to be a tour pro, any
tour. My brother
played in a tourney with a local pro, who couln't make it on any tour,
not even Hooters.
He and his partner shot 56, best ball. 16 under. They eagled 2 par 5's,
and 2 par 4's.
The pro drove the ball 320 to 350, on the fly, and straight. He had no
more than a
7 iron into any par 5, and no more than 75 yards into any par 4. He
drove 4 par 4's,
and was on the fringe of several others. And this guy can't make it on
tour. It's
good to have a dream, but make sure you have a backup plan.Judging by
his spelling,
it better be a trade school. :-)

Date: 06 Sep 2006 19:31:33
From: long&left
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

pete z wrote:
> long&left wrote:
>> sjh wrote:
>>> Darrell Jefress wrote:
>>>> "sjh" <strat68@eudoramail.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:1157575632.048859.172830@b28g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
>>>>
>>>>> Your detractor is arguing semantics of your original statement, but the
>>>>> result is circular as Ogilvy wouldn't be over par either by that
>>>>> argument.... pretzels notwithstanding.
>>>> Yeah, exactly - I thought the whole notion of "anywhere, anytime, any
>>>> conditions" led to some amusing possibilities, simply because it encompasses
>>>> such a wide range of conditions that there's no one on earth who fits the
>>>> bill, *including* the best who've ever teed up a ball.
>>>>
>>>> I thought I was initially being humorous, but it obviously didn't come
>>>> across that way.
>>> Ok, benefit of doubt is in order, and perhaps for L&L- in that he could
>>> have simply said "be a +2" but wanted to avoid that index thing and
>>> notions of true measurements ;-)
>>>
>> I played with a +2 today. But he is a +2 at a course that he plays day
>> in and day out. This guy went to Champions Tour Q school and failed,
>> twice. IOW, +2 doesn't convey what I was trying to say. If I wanted to
>> become a member of the PGA tour, a "touring professional" as stated by
>> the OP, then I would think that I would have to be able to shoot a
>> minimum of 2 under par at any course that I was going to play. No
>> mention of professional events, against professional competition. You
>> can't even get to that point unless you can shoot less than par
>> regularly...that was my point to the OP. I have no idea how the US Open
>> got in the conversation...
>> Dave
>
>
> Yep, most people don't realize how hard it is to be a tour pro, any
> tour. My brother
> played in a tourney with a local pro, who couln't make it on any tour,
> not even Hooters.
> He and his partner shot 56, best ball. 16 under. They eagled 2 par 5's,
> and 2 par 4's.
> The pro drove the ball 320 to 350, on the fly, and straight. He had no
> more than a
> 7 iron into any par 5, and no more than 75 yards into any par 4. He
> drove 4 par 4's,
> and was on the fringe of several others. And this guy can't make it on
> tour. It's
> good to have a dream, but make sure you have a backup plan.Judging by
> his spelling,
> it better be a trade school. :-)
>

my BIL, mentioned earlier in this thread is a perfect example. He's now
33 years old, was once on the mini tours as a Pro, and couldn't make it.
He regained his amateur status and is playing in the USGA qualifying
tournaments for Amateur and Mid Amateur, and can't make it. This guy is
good! He comes here to my course and just beats it up, and yet he can't
get even close to qualifying for anything else. The commercial that says
"these guys are good" is an understatement IMO...
Dave

Date: 06 Sep 2006 19:30:23
From: Bobby Knight
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

On 6 Sep 2006 17:27:08 -0700, "pete z" <pz0326@aol.com > wrote:
> It's good to have a dream, but make sure you have a backup plan.Judging by
>his spelling, it better be a trade school. :-)

He's only 16, and his spelling is about what to expect from most
adults on Usennet :-(
bk

Date: 06 Sep 2006 14:21:32
From: sjh
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

Darrell Jefress wrote:
> "sjh" <strat68@eudoramail.com> wrote in message
> news:1157575632.048859.172830@b28g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
>
> > Your detractor is arguing semantics of your original statement, but the
> > result is circular as Ogilvy wouldn't be over par either by that
> > argument.... pretzels notwithstanding.
>
> Yeah, exactly - I thought the whole notion of "anywhere, anytime, any
> conditions" led to some amusing possibilities, simply because it encompasses
> such a wide range of conditions that there's no one on earth who fits the
> bill, *including* the best who've ever teed up a ball.
>
> I thought I was initially being humorous, but it obviously didn't come
> across that way.

Ok, benefit of doubt is in order, and perhaps for L&L- in that he could
have simply said "be a +2" but wanted to avoid that index thing and
notions of true measurements ;-)

Date: 06 Sep 2006 16:14:44
From: long&left
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

sjh wrote:
> Darrell Jefress wrote:
>> "sjh" <strat68@eudoramail.com> wrote in message
>> news:1157575632.048859.172830@b28g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
>>
>>> Your detractor is arguing semantics of your original statement, but the
>>> result is circular as Ogilvy wouldn't be over par either by that
>>> argument.... pretzels notwithstanding.
>> Yeah, exactly - I thought the whole notion of "anywhere, anytime, any
>> conditions" led to some amusing possibilities, simply because it encompasses
>> such a wide range of conditions that there's no one on earth who fits the
>> bill, *including* the best who've ever teed up a ball.
>>
>> I thought I was initially being humorous, but it obviously didn't come
>> across that way.
>
> Ok, benefit of doubt is in order, and perhaps for L&L- in that he could
> have simply said "be a +2" but wanted to avoid that index thing and
> notions of true measurements ;-)
>

I played with a +2 today. But he is a +2 at a course that he plays day
in and day out. This guy went to Champions Tour Q school and failed,
twice. IOW, +2 doesn't convey what I was trying to say. If I wanted to
become a member of the PGA tour, a "touring professional" as stated by
the OP, then I would think that I would have to be able to shoot a
minimum of 2 under par at any course that I was going to play. No
mention of professional events, against professional competition. You
can't even get to that point unless you can shoot less than par
regularly...that was my point to the OP. I have no idea how the US Open
got in the conversation...
Dave

Date: 06 Sep 2006 23:39:33
From: Matt
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

> become a member of the PGA tour, a "touring professional" as stated by
> the OP, then I would think that I would have to be able to shoot a minimum
> of 2 under par at any course that I was going to play. No mention of
> professional events, against professional competition. You can't even get
> to that point unless you can shoot less than par regularly...that was my
> point to the OP. I have no idea how the US Open got in the conversation...
> Dave

Was it Jeff Sluman who said that if you can shoot -6 at your local golf
courses day in and day out that you MIGHT be good enough to play on the PGA
tour?

Date: 06 Sep 2006 13:47:12
From: sjh
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

long&left wrote:
> Darrell Jefress wrote:
> > Well, five over won it for Mr. Ogilvie, so Mr. Blow woulda won by 13 shots
> > at Winged Foot if he could manage the "two under, anywhere, anytime"
> > standard.
> >
>
> he would have never gotten to the US Open if he couldn't have shot 2
> under, anywhere else, any other time, in any other kind of weather. Get
> real...Does anyone understand the intense pressure involved in becoming
> a touring professional golfer?

I can't speak for you L&L, but would I be close in qualifying the
anytime/where rek by adding:

-2 from the tips at any CC setup for it's members... not for a major
championship, or other professional tour stops?

Your detractor is arguing semantics of your original statement, but the
result is circular as Ogilvy wouldn't be over par either by that
argument.... pretzels notwithstanding.

Date: 06 Sep 2006 16:07:17
From: long&left
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

sjh wrote:
> long&left wrote:
>> Darrell Jefress wrote:
>>> Well, five over won it for Mr. Ogilvie, so Mr. Blow woulda won by 13 shots
>>> at Winged Foot if he could manage the "two under, anywhere, anytime"
>>> standard.
>>>
>> he would have never gotten to the US Open if he couldn't have shot 2
>> under, anywhere else, any other time, in any other kind of weather. Get
>> real...Does anyone understand the intense pressure involved in becoming
>> a touring professional golfer?
>
> I can't speak for you L&L, but would I be close in qualifying the
> anytime/where rek by adding:
>
> -2 from the tips at any CC setup for it's members... not for a major
> championship, or other professional tour stops?
>
> Your detractor is arguing semantics of your original statement, but the
> result is circular as Ogilvy wouldn't be over par either by that
> argument.... pretzels notwithstanding.
>

as I just said in another post, I was talking to the kid and telling him
that IMO he would have to get to the point that he could shoot -2
anywhere, anytime. I didn't bring up the US Open nor did I insinuate
that one would have to shoot -2 in the US Open to do anything. If anyone
thinks that you can be a regular scratch golfer and make it on the US
PGA tour, well, you're wrong
Dave

Date: 06 Sep 2006 21:02:11
From: Darrell Jefress
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

"sjh" <strat68@eudoramail.com > wrote in message
news:1157575632.048859.172830@b28g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...

> Your detractor is arguing semantics of your original statement, but the
> result is circular as Ogilvy wouldn't be over par either by that
> argument.... pretzels notwithstanding.

Yeah, exactly - I thought the whole notion of "anywhere, anytime, any
conditions" led to some amusing possibilities, simply because it encompasses
such a wide range of conditions that there's no one on earth who fits the
bill, *including* the best who've ever teed up a ball.

I thought I was initially being humorous, but it obviously didn't come
across that way.

DJJ

Date: 06 Sep 2006 11:10:38
From: Larry Bud
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

Date: 06 Sep 2006 23:42:21
From: Matt
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

> tw1990 wrote:
>> Im a 16 year old with a 9 handicap and dropping (was 20 at begining of
>> season) and was looking at golf tours for when im older and saw there
>> is a spot on aplication forms for "year turned pro" and was wondering
>> how you go about turning pro and loosing your amature status.
>
> Get down to about a +3 or +4 index and you'll have a chance.
>
> 13 more shots to go!!!

In one of the golf digests, they show what some of the touring pros
handicaps would be if they entered their PGA tour rounds. Woods was a +8,
Micheel, Sorenstam, Weir were +7's. They only did 12 or 14 of them, but
they were all +6's to +8s.

Date: 06 Sep 2006 23:33:11
From: Carbon
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

On Wed, 06 Sep 2006 11:10:38 -0700, Larry Bud wrote:
> tw1990 wrote:

>> Im a 16 year old with a 9 handicap and dropping (was 20 at begining of
>> season) and was looking at golf tours for when im older and saw there
>> is a spot on aplication forms for "year turned pro" and was wondering
>> how you go about turning pro and loosing your amature status.
>
> Get down to about a +3 or +4 index and you'll have a chance.
>
> 13 more shots to go!!!

I'm a 9 and I can't even beat the good players at the local muni!

Date: 06 Sep 2006 23:36:55
From: Matt
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

"Matt" <rebel_144@hotmail.com > wrote in message
news:wWILg.36422$uH6.4601@twister.nyroc.rr.com...
>
> "david s-a" <dsantwyk@bigpond.net.au> wrote in message
> news:4m919nF53jdtU1@individual.net...
>> Colin Wilson wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> I was simply suggesting there are other alternatives (although I agree
>>> this thread is certainly titled "touring pro") in "pro golf" to making
>>> the USPGA tour. They are the elite 150 in the whole world. There are
>>> thousands of golfers making various levels of income by being
>>> professionals ... some a good living, some not much at all. You can
>>> enter the club pro trainee program here in Australia with a handicap of
>>> 4, and do a university course as part of it.
>>>
>>
>>
>> That doesn't make you a 'touring pro' here Colin.....but it qualifies you
>> as a member of the PGA....a necessary status for a 'club professional'.
>> AFAIK you only need to enter and succeed at 'Q' school in order to gain
>> entry to the PGA Tour......you do not need to be a current trainee or PGA
>> member. Most Aussie touring pros started off this way. Here I think 'Q'
>> school qualifying means a 6 round tournament, battling for only a few
>> available spots......and to succeed amongst all that talented amateur and
>> professional competition requires you to be playing at a standard far
>> higher than that of the average working pro.
>>
>> Rather like qualifying rounds for the State and National 'Open'
>> tournaments ....the pressure to qualify is far higher than making the
>> 'cut' in any pro tournament.
>>
>> cheers
>> david
>
>
> Once you gain entry on ANY professional tour in the USA anyways, you
> become classified by the PGA of America as a Class A-3 PGA Professional.

well maybe not any, but the well known ones...

Date: 06 Sep 2006 08:58:41
From: Parinella
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

tw1990 wrote:
> Im a 16 year old with a 9 handicap and dropping (was 20 at begining of
> season) and was looking at golf tours for when im older and saw there
> is a spot on aplication forms for "year turned pro" and was wondering
> how you go about turning pro and loosing your amature status.

First, read "The Fine Green Line" by John Paul Newport. The author was
a 3 handicap and wanted to see what it was like to go pro, so devoted a
year of his life to improving and playing the mini-tours and going to
Q-School. In the end, he had a better swing and was a more complete
player, but improved to only maybe a 2 handicap and embarrassed himself
at Q-School.

Date: 06 Sep 2006 10:27:17
From: sfb
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

When you can break par five days in a row from the tips on the toughest
tracks in town, check back in with us. Meantime, hit the books in school and
maintain your amateur status as there are many opportunities to play
tournament golf as a amateur as you develop your game.

"tw1990" <tw1990_1@hotmail.com > wrote in message
news:1157498134.713657.273250@e3g2000cwe.googlegroups.com...
> Im a 16 year old with a 9 handicap and dropping (was 20 at begining of
> season) and was looking at golf tours for when im older and saw there
> is a spot on aplication forms for "year turned pro" and was wondering
> how you go about turning pro and loosing your amature status.
>

Date: 06 Sep 2006 07:12:25
From: JimAmigo
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

Your diminishing handicap over the summer should be commended. BUT to
be make it as a professional golfer your not even at the half way point
to even consider such a jump. Shaving those first 11 strokes off the
handicap might have come quickly but the final nine to get to scratch
could take years. Plus, if you're 16 with a 9 handicap then you're way
behind others who've played since birth and competed in junior events
for over 10 years. I would suggest entering some local am tourneys or
join your high school team to get a taste of the skill needed at that
level first. Getting to a 9 with your buddies over a summer is
different than playing strictly by the rules with other competitors and
galleries watching.

Your talent as a golfer is relative to level of players your play with;
you may be a god to all the hackers at your local course/club as a 9
but that same 9 won't get you a scholarship.

With that being said, your lofty aspirations should be praised and I
hope you posses the raw talent, work ethic and more importantly hard
headed determination to reach your goals.

tw1990 wrote:
> Im a 16 year old with a 9 handicap and dropping (was 20 at beginning of
> season) and was looking at golf tours for when im older and saw there
> is a spot on application forms for "year turned pro" and was wondering
> how you go about turning pro and loosing your amature status.

Date: 06 Sep 2006 00:46:39
From: Simon
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

long&left wrote:

> 3putt wrote:
> > "tw1990" <tw1990_1@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> > news:1157498134.713657.273250@e3g2000cwe.googlegroups.com...
> >> Im a 16 year old with a 9 handicap and dropping (was 20 at begining of
> >> season) and was looking at golf tours for when im older and saw there
> >> is a spot on aplication forms for "year turned pro" and was wondering
> >> how you go about turning pro and loosing your amature status.
> >>
> > Well, first you need to improve on your gram or your interviews will
> > suck. I'd also get a web mail program that has spellcheck. Finish high
> > school, don't get any tattoos, and earn a golf scholarship to Georgia Tech.
> >
> >
>
> all good advice! Plus be able to shoot -2 on any course anywhere in the
> USA anytime in any weather...then you can go to Q School and become a Pro
> Dave

To have a chance of making it as a pro, you'd probably need to have a
handicap of +2 or so. If you have only just started playing, then
dropping from 20 to 9 this shows some ability. I'd expect you to be 4
or 5 next year, then 1 or 2 when you are 18. Get yourself to a golfing
university and hopefully you can drop down to +2.

That would indicate you should have the playing ability to make it as a
pro, but there's a lot more to it than that. Take a look at the top
amateurs who have tried to make it as a pro in the last few years. I
would think that the majority of these fail to get anywhere.

Why do you want to do this? Do you think it sounds like a cool
lifestyle? Or do you have a burning ambition to be a great sportsman?

Date: 06 Sep 2006 02:25:58
From: water
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

In My Most Humble Opinion
Don't turn pro yet! Are you crazy?
Turning Pro(though probably should not be the last thing on your mind)
should definitely not be the first and foremost at this moment in your life.
Say you knock yourself down to scratch or better in the next year and enter
and win some cash in some mini-tour you discovered, boom you're a Pro....and
consequently lost your NCAA eligibility. Probably not a good idea regardless
of how great you are or can be.

Get in good with your High School golf coach and guidance counselor. If your
school doesn't have a team, talk to your guidance counselor and look into a
junior golf program. If you're the type of guy who doesn't like to talk to
guidance counselors, get over it and do it "for the love of your game."
Concentrate on a golf scholarship to some university with a respectable
team. Do a little research on that topic and write some letters to the golf
coaches. Grab some golf scholarship and go to college. The level of
experience you will gain from NCAA competition is priceless at this point in
your life. Why pass that up if you are seriously dreaming of being a tour
level player?
From there you'll have very qualified coaches and individuals who will guide
both your evolving golf game and your budding career on the PGA if you they
see or you convince them that you have the gift.
If not, hey you're in college. Drink some beer and get a Liberal Arts
degree.

Seriously though start asking "How do I get a golf scholarship?" and not
"How do I turn Pro?" There are people at the University who will grant you
infinitely more qualified advice then us trolls on the Internet regarding
getting you on track to your goals. All your questions will be answered.
Patience young grasshopper....

Good luck!

-water

"tw1990" <tw1990_1@hotmail.com > wrote in message
news:1157498134.713657.273250@e3g2000cwe.googlegroups.com...
> Im a 16 year old with a 9 handicap and dropping (was 20 at begining of
> season) and was looking at golf tours for when im older and saw there
> is a spot on aplication forms for "year turned pro" and was wondering
> how you go about turning pro and loosing your amature status.
>

Date: 06 Sep 2006 13:42:54
From: muk
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

The L to L drill

Date: 05 Sep 2006 22:20:02
From: Wayne
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

tw1990 wrote:

> Im a 16 year old with a 9 handicap and dropping (was 20 at begining of
> season) and was looking at golf tours for when im older and saw there
> is a spot on aplication forms for "year turned pro" and was wondering
> how you go about turning pro and loosing your amature status.

I think you might be putting the cart before the horse, young man. Right
now, I'd concentrate on maybe being good enough to get some kind of golf
scholarship and making sure I had some kind of fall back plan in case
things don't work out. You've done very well to go from 20 to 9 this
season, but you've still got a long way to go to get to the point of being
able to be a successful touring pro.

Wayne
--
www.nhlfa.com
"There are only two things I can't stand in this world: people who are
intolerant of other peoples' cultures, and the Dutch."
-Nigel Powers

Date: 05 Sep 2006 19:11:14
From: pete z
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

Date: 05 Sep 2006 18:44:17
From: zumafan
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

tw1990 wrote:
> Im a 16 year old with a 9 handicap and dropping (was 20 at begining of
> season) and was looking at golf tours for when im older and saw there
> is a spot on aplication forms for "year turned pro" and was wondering
> how you go about turning pro and loosing your amature status.

you can go to www.usga.org to read the rules of amateur status but
basically, to be a pro you enter a tournament to win a cash prize,
accept a prize worth a certain amount (I believe it's up to six or
seven hundred dollars) or receive compensation based on your
reputation. Something like that, you can find the exact rules on the
USGA site.

Date: 05 Sep 2006 21:06:56
From:
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

Thanks for the info.
==
>Re: Becoming a touring pro
>Group: rec.sport.golf Date: Tue, Sep 5, 2006, 6:44pm (CDT-2) From:
>mgeorg@gmail.com (zumafan)
>tw1990 wrote:
>Im a 16 year old with a 9 handicap and
>dropping (was 20 at begining of season) and was looking
>at golf tours for when im older and saw there
>is a spot on aplication forms for "year turned pro"
>and was wondering how you go about turning pro and
>loosing your amature status.
>you can go to www.usga.org to read the rules of
>amateur status but basically, to be a pro you enter
>a tournament to win a cash prize, accept a prize
>worth a certain amount (I believe it's up to six
>or seven hundred dollars) or receive compensation based on your
>reputation. Something like that, you can find the exact rules
>on the USGA site.

Date: 05 Sep 2006 20:46:15
From: Aress Gee
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

"zumafan" <mgeorg@gmail.com > writes:

> tw1990 wrote:
> > Im a 16 year old with a 9 handicap and dropping (was 20 at begining of
> > season) and was looking at golf tours for when im older and saw there
> > is a spot on aplication forms for "year turned pro" and was wondering
> > how you go about turning pro and loosing your amature status.
>
> you can go to www.usga.org to read the rules of amateur status but
> basically, to be a pro you enter a tournament to win a cash prize,
> accept a prize worth a certain amount (I believe it's up to six or
> seven hundred dollars) or receive compensation based on your
> reputation. Something like that, you can find the exact rules on the
> USGA site.

Lo[o]sing one's amateur status is as easy as saying, "I am
a professional golfer."

Rule 2-1 (Rules of Amateur Status).

--

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Mr. Aress Gee
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Date: 05 Sep 2006 23:21:43
From: 3putt
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

"tw1990" <tw1990_1@hotmail.com > wrote in message
news:1157498134.713657.273250@e3g2000cwe.googlegroups.com...
> Im a 16 year old with a 9 handicap and dropping (was 20 at begining of
> season) and was looking at golf tours for when im older and saw there
> is a spot on aplication forms for "year turned pro" and was wondering
> how you go about turning pro and loosing your amature status.
>
Well, first you need to improve on your gram or your interviews will
suck. I'd also get a web mail program that has spellcheck. Finish high
school, don't get any tattoos, and earn a golf scholarship to Georgia Tech.

Date: 05 Sep 2006 17:03:58
From: long&left
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

3putt wrote:
> "tw1990" <tw1990_1@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:1157498134.713657.273250@e3g2000cwe.googlegroups.com...
>> Im a 16 year old with a 9 handicap and dropping (was 20 at begining of
>> season) and was looking at golf tours for when im older and saw there
>> is a spot on aplication forms for "year turned pro" and was wondering
>> how you go about turning pro and loosing your amature status.
>>
> Well, first you need to improve on your gram or your interviews will
> suck. I'd also get a web mail program that has spellcheck. Finish high
> school, don't get any tattoos, and earn a golf scholarship to Georgia Tech.
>
>

all good advice! Plus be able to shoot -2 on any course anywhere in the
USA anytime in any weather...then you can go to Q School and become a Pro
Dave

Date: 06 Sep 2006 02:06:40
From: Colin Wilson
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

long&left wrote:

> all good advice! Plus be able to shoot -2 on any course anywhere in the
> USA anytime in any weather...then you can go to Q School and become a Pro

I'm not sure being on the main USPGA Tour is the only way to make a
living as a pro. Only way to get super rich maybe, but there are other
ways to "make it". The tales about trailer living and sleeping in the
back of the car are not facts of life for everyone.

About a quarter of the Asian Tour, for example, is now made up of
Australians. A series of good finishes (without even winning) will make
you about US$250,000 a year. I've seen figures quoted of about $2500 per
week expenses when on tour, so with 40 weeks touring, that's $100,000.
Now, of course you've still got to be very, very good, but if I could
make US$150,000 per year playing golf, I'd figure I was very comfortable.

A salaried or commission pro (green fee percentage plus teaching and
stock sales) at any quality golf course can also make a reasonable
income, certainly one that puts you well past being poor. There'd also
be the side income from a few pro-ams, even if it was only a few
thousand per year. You still get paid to golf.

--
Cheers
Colin Wilson
------------------------------------------------------------------
Trentham Golf Club: http://www.trenthamgolf.com
Barnbougle Dunes: http://publishing.kyneton.net.au/barnbougle
------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: 05 Sep 2006 21:07:17
From: long&left
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

Colin Wilson wrote:
> long&left wrote:
>
>> all good advice! Plus be able to shoot -2 on any course anywhere in
>> the USA anytime in any weather...then you can go to Q School and
>> become a Pro
>
> I'm not sure being on the main USPGA Tour is the only way to make a
> living as a pro. Only way to get super rich maybe, but there are other
> ways to "make it". The tales about trailer living and sleeping in the
> back of the car are not facts of life for everyone.
>
> About a quarter of the Asian Tour, for example, is now made up of
> Australians. A series of good finishes (without even winning) will make
> you about US$250,000 a year. I've seen figures quoted of about $2500 per
> week expenses when on tour, so with 40 weeks touring, that's $100,000.
> Now, of course you've still got to be very, very good, but if I could
> make US$150,000 per year playing golf, I'd figure I was very comfortable.
>
> A salaried or commission pro (green fee percentage plus teaching and
> stock sales) at any quality golf course can also make a reasonable
> income, certainly one that puts you well past being poor. There'd also
> be the side income from a few pro-ams, even if it was only a few
> thousand per year. You still get paid to golf.
>

Colin, I love you man...but trying to make a living as a golf
professional is a long long long hard road. I don't understand
everyone's naivety about this. It's f***g easier to go to Stanford and
become a nuclear scientist...To urge a 16 year old along the path of pro
golfdom is just wrong IMO

Date: 06 Sep 2006 05:44:14
From: Colin Wilson
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

long&left wrote:

> trying to make a living as a golf
> professional is a long long long hard road. I don't understand
> everyone's naivety about this. It's f***g easier to go to Stanford and
> become a nuclear scientist...To urge a 16 year old along the path of pro
> golfdom is just wrong IMO

Of course, to be a professional golfer needs a high level of skill and
application. But with talent, I don't think it needs a lot more hours
than a 5- or 6-year university science degree. There'd certainly be much
less drudgery, since a committed golfer would probably enjoy practice a
lot more than a budding scientist would enjoy writing essays. The only
thing you can say is that there will be much less certainty that they'll
ever make it.

I was simply suggesting there are other alternatives (although I agree
this thread is certainly titled "touring pro") in "pro golf" to making
the USPGA tour. They are the elite 150 in the whole world. There are
thousands of golfers making various levels of income by being
professionals ... some a good living, some not much at all. You can
enter the club pro trainee program here in Australia with a handicap of
4, and do a university course as part of it.

I'm not "urging" a 16-year-old to become a pro. It's just a question a
lot of golf-loving kids ponder around that age, and I don't think it is
our duty to kill off interest by saying from the outset "you'll never
make it, it'll be too hard". Make them understand the hard road, for
sure, but don't kill off their motivation.

There are also lots of jobs available in areas like golf management,
event management, even hospitality, that could satisfy a golf-loving kid
for a career.

--
Cheers
Colin Wilson
------------------------------------------------------------------
Trentham Golf Club: http://www.trenthamgolf.com
Barnbougle Dunes: http://publishing.kyneton.net.au/barnbougle
------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: 07 Sep 2006 08:43:59
From: david s-a
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

Colin Wilson wrote:

>
> I was simply suggesting there are other alternatives (although I agree
> this thread is certainly titled "touring pro") in "pro golf" to making
> the USPGA tour. They are the elite 150 in the whole world. There are
> thousands of golfers making various levels of income by being
> professionals ... some a good living, some not much at all. You can
> enter the club pro trainee program here in Australia with a handicap of
> 4, and do a university course as part of it.
>

That doesn't make you a 'touring pro' here Colin.....but it qualifies
you as a member of the PGA....a necessary status for a 'club
professional'. AFAIK you only need to enter and succeed at 'Q' school in
order to gain entry to the PGA Tour......you do not need to be a current
trainee or PGA member. Most Aussie touring pros started off this way.
Here I think 'Q' school qualifying means a 6 round tournament, battling
for only a few available spots......and to succeed amongst all that
talented amateur and professional competition requires you to be playing
at a standard far higher than that of the average working pro.

Rather like qualifying rounds for the State and National 'Open'
tournaments ....the pressure to qualify is far higher than making the
'cut' in any pro tournament.

cheers
david

Date:
From:
Subject:

Date: 06 Sep 2006 07:37:52
From: long&left
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

Colin Wilson wrote:
> long&left wrote:
>
>> trying to make a living as a golf professional is a long long long
>> hard road. I don't understand everyone's naivety about this. It's
>> f***g easier to go to Stanford and become a nuclear scientist...To
>> urge a 16 year old along the path of pro golfdom is just wrong IMO
>
> Of course, to be a professional golfer needs a high level of skill and
> application. But with talent, I don't think it needs a lot more hours
> than a 5- or 6-year university science degree. There'd certainly be much
> less drudgery, since a committed golfer would probably enjoy practice a
> lot more than a budding scientist would enjoy writing essays. The only
> thing you can say is that there will be much less certainty that they'll
> ever make it.
>
> I was simply suggesting there are other alternatives (although I agree
> this thread is certainly titled "touring pro") in "pro golf" to making
> the USPGA tour. They are the elite 150 in the whole world. There are
> thousands of golfers making various levels of income by being
> professionals ... some a good living, some not much at all. You can
> enter the club pro trainee program here in Australia with a handicap of
> 4, and do a university course as part of it.
>
> I'm not "urging" a 16-year-old to become a pro. It's just a question a
> lot of golf-loving kids ponder around that age, and I don't think it is
> our duty to kill off interest by saying from the outset "you'll never
> make it, it'll be too hard". Make them understand the hard road, for
> sure, but don't kill off their motivation.
>
> There are also lots of jobs available in areas like golf management,
> event management, even hospitality, that could satisfy a golf-loving kid
> for a career.
>

well, you're probably right about not killing a kids interest. But here
in the US there are not many professional golfers making good money.
More like poverty level for most of them at the club asst or pro level.
We just hired a new Pro at my club. I've been told his salary is $78k a
year. Not bad huh? Righto, but the median price of a home here is $685k.
While the rest of the USA is paying $2.09 for gas we pay $2.59 and on
and on and on. He'd probably be better off making $35k in AR or AL
Dave

Date: 06 Sep 2006 22:05:22
From: Matt
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

>
> well, you're probably right about not killing a kids interest. But here in
> the US there are not many professional golfers making good money. More
> like poverty level for most of them at the club asst or pro level. We just
> hired a new Pro at my club. I've been told his salary is $78k a year. Not
> bad huh? Righto, but the median price of a home here is $685k. While the
> rest of the USA is paying $2.09 for gas we pay $2.59 and on and on and on.
> He'd probably be better off making $35k in AR or AL
> Dave

2.59 is cheap as hell!!! Where the hell do you live??

Date: 06 Sep 2006 16:08:53
From: long&left
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

Matt wrote:
>> well, you're probably right about not killing a kids interest. But here in
>> the US there are not many professional golfers making good money. More
>> like poverty level for most of them at the club asst or pro level. We just
>> hired a new Pro at my club. I've been told his salary is $78k a year. Not
>> bad huh? Righto, but the median price of a home here is $685k. While the
>> rest of the USA is paying $2.09 for gas we pay $2.59 and on and on and on.
>> He'd probably be better off making $35k in AR or AL
>> Dave
>
> 2.59 is cheap as hell!!! Where the hell do you live??
>
>

oops, typo...should have been $3.09 and $3.59. It was early and I was on
my first cup of coffee :)

Date: 06 Sep 2006 00:08:23
From: Matt
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

Plus be able to shoot -2 on any course anywhere in the
> USA anytime in any weather...then you can go to Q School and become a Pro
> Dave

I dont know about the -2 on any course, anywhere, in any weather.....
thats a bit extreme.

Date: 06 Sep 2006 00:33:22
From: Darrell Jefress
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

"Matt" <rebel_144@hotmail.com > wrote in message
news:XjoLg.34048$8j3.13868@twister.nyroc.rr.com...
> Plus be able to shoot -2 on any course anywhere in the
> > USA anytime in any weather...then you can go to Q School and become a
Pro
> > Dave
>
> I dont know about the -2 on any course, anywhere, in any weather.....
> thats a bit extreme.

It does, though, put one in very good position trying to win the US Open.

DJJ

Date: 05 Sep 2006 18:25:25
From: long&left
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

Darrell Jefress wrote:
> "Matt" <rebel_144@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:XjoLg.34048$8j3.13868@twister.nyroc.rr.com...
>> Plus be able to shoot -2 on any course anywhere in the
>>> USA anytime in any weather...then you can go to Q School and become a
> Pro
>>> Dave
>> I dont know about the -2 on any course, anywhere, in any weather.....
>> thats a bit extreme.
>
> It does, though, put one in very good position trying to win the US Open.
>
> DJJ
>
>

are you guys naive? To play and be successful on the PGA tour one would
be able to shoot -2 on any course, anywhere, anytime...Now, if the OP
was wanting to settle for the mini tours, then one could set their
sights a bit lower. 16 year olds need to be told the truth and not led
down the flowery path IMO. My BIL, who now works for UBS, is a ex mini
tour player. He played at my course with me a month ago and shot a 69
(par 72) his first time here. He also tried to qualify for the US
Amateur in Palm Springs area and shot 70-69 and didn't even get a sniff.
You don't become a professional golfer by shooting par these days. Any
Joe Blow can shoot par, anywhere, anytime...
Dave

Date: 07 Sep 2006 02:17:17
From: Sparky
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

On 5-Sep-2006, long&left <nospam@diespammers.com > wrote:

> are you guys naive? To play and be successful on the PGA tour one would
> be able to shoot -2 on any course, anywhere, anytime...Now, if the OP
> was wanting to settle for the mini tours, then one could set their
> sights a bit lower. 16 year olds need to be told the truth and not led
> down the flowery path IMO. My BIL, who now works for UBS, is a ex mini
> tour player. He played at my course with me a month ago and shot a 69
> (par 72) his first time here. He also tried to qualify for the US
> Amateur in Palm Springs area and shot 70-69 and didn't even get a sniff.
> You don't become a professional golfer by shooting par these days. Any
> Joe Blow can shoot par, anywhere, anytime...
> Dave

Don't even think about a life on tour unless you can beat everyone in your
state....

me -------- > Mediocre Club Pro

Date: 06 Sep 2006 19:26:58
From: long&left
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

Sparky wrote:
> On 5-Sep-2006, long&left <nospam@diespammers.com> wrote:
>
>> are you guys naive? To play and be successful on the PGA tour one would
>> be able to shoot -2 on any course, anywhere, anytime...Now, if the OP
>> was wanting to settle for the mini tours, then one could set their
>> sights a bit lower. 16 year olds need to be told the truth and not led
>> down the flowery path IMO. My BIL, who now works for UBS, is a ex mini
>> tour player. He played at my course with me a month ago and shot a 69
>> (par 72) his first time here. He also tried to qualify for the US
>> Amateur in Palm Springs area and shot 70-69 and didn't even get a sniff.
>> You don't become a professional golfer by shooting par these days. Any
>> Joe Blow can shoot par, anywhere, anytime...
>> Dave
>
> Don't even think about a life on tour unless you can beat everyone in your
> state....
>
>
> me --------> Mediocre Club Pro

Thanks Sparky...my point exactly!!

it ain't easy being a "golf Pro"...
Dave

Date: 06 Sep 2006 06:37:01
From: David Sneddon
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

long&left wrote:

> are you guys naive? To play and be successful on the PGA tour one would
> be able to shoot -2 on any course, anywhere, anytime...Now, if the OP
> was wanting to settle for the mini tours, then one could set their
> sights a bit lower. 16 year olds need to be told the truth and not led
> down the flowery path IMO. My BIL, who now works for UBS, is a ex mini
> tour player. He played at my course with me a month ago and shot a 69
> (par 72) his first time here. He also tried to qualify for the US
> Amateur in Palm Springs area and shot 70-69 and didn't even get a sniff.
> You don't become a professional golfer by shooting par these days. Any
> Joe Blow can shoot par, anywhere, anytime...
> Dave

Very true, Dave. Local guy, was #1 at UNLV, NCAA etc. etc., He can go
way low - 63/65/67 etc. Struggling on the mini-tours right now.

David

Date: 06 Sep 2006 09:02:32
From: Alan Murphy
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

"long&left" <nospam@diespammers.com > wrote in message
news:6spLg.695$d_2.580@newsfe03.lga...
> Darrell Jefress wrote:
>> "Matt" <rebel_144@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:XjoLg.34048$8j3.13868@twister.nyroc.rr.com...
>>> Plus be able to shoot -2 on any course anywhere in the
>>>> USA anytime in any weather...then you can go to Q School and become a
>> Pro
>>>> Dave
>>> I dont know about the -2 on any course, anywhere, in any weather.....
>>> thats a bit extreme.
>>
>> It does, though, put one in very good position trying to win the US
>> Open.
>>
>> DJJ
>>
>>
>
> are you guys naive? To play and be successful on the PGA tour one would
> be able to shoot -2 on any course, anywhere, anytime...Now, if the OP was
> wanting to settle for the mini tours, then one could set their sights a
> bit lower. 16 year olds need to be told the truth and not led down the
> flowery path IMO. My BIL, who now works for UBS, is a ex mini tour
> player. He played at my course with me a month ago and shot a 69 (par 72)
> his first time here. He also tried to qualify for the US Amateur in Palm
> Springs area and shot 70-69 and didn't even get a sniff. You don't become
> a professional golfer by shooting par these days. Any Joe Blow can shoot
> par, anywhere, anytime...
> Dave

Birdie is the new par.

Alan

Date: 06 Sep 2006 01:37:35
From: Darrell Jefress
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

"long&left" <nospam@diespammers.com > wrote in message
news:6spLg.695$d_2.580@newsfe03.lga...

> Any Joe Blow can shoot par, anywhere, anytime...

Any Joe Blow should have gone to Winged Foot.

DJJ

Date: 05 Sep 2006 20:42:10
From: Aress Gee
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

"Darrell Jefress" <evely7@tokyo.com > writes:

> "long&left" <nospam@diespammers.com> wrote in message
> news:6spLg.695$d_2.580@newsfe03.lga...
>
> > Any Joe Blow can shoot par, anywhere, anytime...
>
> Any Joe Blow should have gone to Winged Foot.

With those numbers, Mr. Blow would have trouble
with Local Qualifying (and have no chance at Sectional).

--

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Mr. Aress Gee
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Date: 06 Sep 2006 15:42:50
From: Darrell Jefress
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

"Aress Gee" <invalid@not_real_address.com > wrote in message
news:barirk193f1.fsf@server007.serverquality.com...
> "Darrell Jefress" <evely7@tokyo.com> writes:
>
> > "long&left" <nospam@diespammers.com> wrote in message
> > news:6spLg.695$d_2.580@newsfe03.lga...
> >
> > > Any Joe Blow can shoot par, anywhere, anytime...
> >
> > Any Joe Blow should have gone to Winged Foot.
>
> With those numbers, Mr. Blow would have trouble
> with Local Qualifying (and have no chance at Sectional).

Looking through the results, there were at least 28 local qualifying sites
at which 2 under would have advanced. The sectional qualifying results seem
to have disappeared from the official USGA site, but I suspect that at some
of the sectionals a score of 4 under for 36 would have advanced. After that,
eight under for 72 would have trounced the fields at Shinnecock, Pinehurst,
and Winged Foot the past three years.

So if the standard really is "2 under any place, any time, under any
conditions", that's a player who could dominate the US Open, even if he
couldn't win in Milwaukee or even make the cut in Vegas.

DJJ

Date: 06 Sep 2006 16:04:34
From: long&left
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

Darrell Jefress wrote:
> "Aress Gee" <invalid@not_real_address.com> wrote in message
> news:barirk193f1.fsf@server007.serverquality.com...
>> "Darrell Jefress" <evely7@tokyo.com> writes:
>>
>>> "long&left" <nospam@diespammers.com> wrote in message
>>> news:6spLg.695$d_2.580@newsfe03.lga...
>>>
>>>> Any Joe Blow can shoot par, anywhere, anytime...
>>> Any Joe Blow should have gone to Winged Foot.
>> With those numbers, Mr. Blow would have trouble
>> with Local Qualifying (and have no chance at Sectional).
>
> Looking through the results, there were at least 28 local qualifying sites
> at which 2 under would have advanced. The sectional qualifying results seem
> to have disappeared from the official USGA site, but I suspect that at some
> of the sectionals a score of 4 under for 36 would have advanced. After that,
> eight under for 72 would have trounced the fields at Shinnecock, Pinehurst,
> and Winged Foot the past three years.
>
> So if the standard really is "2 under any place, any time, under any
> conditions", that's a player who could dominate the US Open, even if he
> couldn't win in Milwaukee or even make the cut in Vegas.
>
> DJJ
>
>

we had a US Am qualifier here and the low medalist shot 66 - 69 (par 72
course). I don't know how he did in the US Am but my guess would be
you'll never hear of him ever again...And, I didn't bring up the US Open
when I said "2 under any place, any time....". What I was referring to
is an individual needs to be able to shoot under par most anywhere under
varying conditions to even have a sniff of becoming a touring golf
professional. Getting to the US Open is another matter...
Dave

Date: 06 Sep 2006 11:08:27
From: Aress Gee
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

"Darrell Jefress" <evely7@tokyo.com > writes:

> "Aress Gee" <invalid@not_real_address.com> wrote in message
> news:barirk193f1.fsf@server007.serverquality.com...
> > "Darrell Jefress" <evely7@tokyo.com> writes:
> >
> > > "long&left" <nospam@diespammers.com> wrote in message
> > > news:6spLg.695$d_2.580@newsfe03.lga...
> > >
> > > > Any Joe Blow can shoot par, anywhere, anytime...
> > >
> > > Any Joe Blow should have gone to Winged Foot.
> >
> > With those numbers, Mr. Blow would have trouble
> > with Local Qualifying (and have no chance at Sectional).
>
> Looking through the results, there were at least 28 local qualifying sites
> at which 2 under would have advanced. The sectional qualifying results seem
> to have disappeared from the official USGA site, but I suspect that at some
> of the sectionals a score of 4 under for 36 would have advanced. After that,
> eight under for 72 would have trounced the fields at Shinnecock, Pinehurst,
> and Winged Foot the past three years.
>
> So if the standard really is "2 under any place, any time, under any
> conditions", that's a player who could dominate the US Open, even if he
> couldn't win in Milwaukee or even make the cut in Vegas.

The post that I responded to was in regards to a player
shooting par, not -2.

> > > > Any Joe Blow can shoot par, anywhere, anytime...

From the effort you have put in this is clearly
more important to you than it is to me.

Victory is yours.

--

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Mr. Aress Gee
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Date: 06 Sep 2006 02:31:41
From: Darrell Jefress
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

Date: 05 Sep 2006 21:10:51
From: long&left
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

Date: 06 Sep 2006 01:30:07
From:
Subject: Re: Becoming a touring pro

>Does anyone understand the intense pressure involved in becoming a
>touring professional golfer?
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
A major is a major, they are not given for the asking, becoming a golf
pro is part of

the curriculum, it is what you make of it, some are golf pro material,
some aren't.

You wouldn't want to drop golf if your scholarship was predicated on it.
So suck it in, get with it.

>m h o
>=A0v =83e

>>=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0e s p r i t =A0d e =A0c o r p